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The Most Valuable Card - The Trump Deuce 9-card fits and other matters

#1 User is offline   Winstonm 

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Posted 2007-November-02, 06:50

I can think of no card stronger than the fourth x of support. Whereas AK543 opposite 876 offers zero percent chance for no losers, the addition of the 2 to make it 8762 increases the odds to roughly 40% chance of having no loser.

Are there other single card holdings that substantially increase chances, and if so how much does that card change the percentages?
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#2 User is offline   FrancesHinden 

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Posted 2007-November-02, 08:03

Winstonm, on Nov 2 2007, 01:50 PM, said:

I can think of no card stronger than the fourth x of support. Whereas AK543 opposite 876 offers zero percent chance for no losers, the addition of the 2 to make it 8762 increases the odds to roughly 40% chance of having no loser.

Are there other single card holdings that substantially increase chances, and if so how much does that card change the percentages?

KQJ10987 opposite 32 = 0% chance of no loser
KQJ10987 opposite A2 = 100% chance of no loser
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#3 User is offline   han 

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Posted 2007-November-02, 08:57

Agree, one can probably make an argument that the trump ace is the strongest card in the game.
Please note: I am interested in boring, bog standard, 2/1.

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#4 User is offline   helene_t 

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Posted 2007-November-02, 09:58

Probably, lol.
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#5 User is offline   kenberg 

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Posted 2007-November-02, 10:40

It's true that aces tend to increase the number of winners in a suit, especially in the trump suit. :) We can try for other cards tho.

With a defensive holding of QJ tight you would prefer your partner hold 52 rather than 5 or 2 alone. No guarantees of course.

PS I did once hold the ace of trumps on lead against a grand. I cashed it before anyone could revoke. At the other table they had time problems and didn't play the hand. So the value of an ace is subject to the whims of fate.
Ken
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#6 User is offline   pclayton 

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Posted 2007-November-02, 10:58

FrancesHinden, on Nov 2 2007, 06:03 AM, said:

Winstonm, on Nov 2 2007, 01:50 PM, said:

I can think of no card stronger than the fourth x of support.  Whereas AK543 opposite 876 offers zero percent chance for no losers, the addition of the 2 to make it 8762 increases the odds to roughly 40% chance of having no loser.

Are there other single card holdings that substantially increase chances, and if so how much does that card change the percentages?

KQJ10987 opposite 32 = 0% chance of no loser
KQJ10987 opposite A2 = 100% chance of no loser

On a similar note:

AKx opposite xxxxx = zero chance for 5 tricks
AKx opposite Qxxxx = 68% chance for 5 tricks
"Phil" on BBO
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#7 User is offline   Trumpace 

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Posted 2007-November-02, 11:25

Hannie, on Nov 2 2007, 09:57 AM, said:

Agree, one can probably make an argument that the trump ace is the strongest card in the game.

Most definitely! lol :P
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#8 User is offline   cherdano 

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Posted 2007-November-02, 11:48

I can beat that. A2 opposite QJT9876543 = 100% chance of no loser, 2 opposite QJT9876543 = 52% chance of one loser, 48% chance of 2 losers.
The easiest way to count losers is to line up the people who talk about loser count, and count them. -Kieran Dyke
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#9 User is offline   awm 

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Posted 2007-November-02, 12:37

How about this one (in notrump):

AKQJ opposite 876543

Four tricks (assuming not entries).

AKQ2 opposite 876543

Six tricks.

So a deuce was two tricks better than a jack? :P
Adam W. Meyerson
a.k.a. Appeal Without Merit
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#10 User is offline   Winstonm 

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Posted 2007-November-02, 18:02

What about a Jack? How about AK10xx opposite xxx verses AKJxxx opposite xxx?
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#11 User is offline   Tola18 

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Posted 2007-November-03, 05:46

Winstonm, on Nov 2 2007, 07:02 PM, said:

What about a Jack?

In semisolid holdings, where there is one sure loser but hopefully not two, a jack, or sometimes even a 10 - has almost the same walue as an ace.

Thus, feks opposing partners opening sound weak 2, an J, even alone - is much worth, as we KNOW it makes the suit selfplaying - mostly one loser.
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#12 User is offline   Tola18 

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Posted 2007-November-03, 05:48

I agree with the first post, 54 is often much stronger than 44 or 53. Especially with somewhat shaky hands without raw force. (Having raw force 44 or 53 is fine).
You MAY very well get down, but it will almost never by costly.



A wonderful thread!
Cats bring joy and a feeling of harmony and well-being into a home.
Many homeless cats seek a home.
Adopt one. Contact a cat shelter!
You too can be an everyday hero. :)
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