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Another RKCB disaster

#1 User is offline   thepossum 

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Posted 2020-November-21, 03:05

Hi all

I think I am entitled to feel somewhat peeved with this, despite only having 1 diamond



I considered going to 6NT but people struggled in NT, some missed out on 6 clubs (I dont like to compete with partner) and as far as I can see if my partner had the promised Queen and the break had been 4-1 (not5-0) it would have made 6D

regards P

PS Before anyone tells me - but you were commiting to 6D with my 4NT, the title of my post relates to RKCB. However it was the lie about the Queen that upset me - I had other options in my mind too. Come to think of it are then any documented escapes from Blackwood or RKCB or has all the space for escaping been used up?
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#2 User is offline   smerriman 

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Posted 2020-November-21, 04:32

The issue here is that the description of 4NT promises 3 diamonds. Thus with a 10 card fit, GIB's response is correct, as per at least a couple of earlier threads of yours.

So it's the definition of 4NT that needs correcting, since it makes no sense for that to promise 3 diamonds.
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#3 User is offline   pescetom 

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Posted 2020-November-21, 07:56

View Postsmerriman, on 2020-November-21, 04:32, said:

The issue here is that the description of 4NT promises 3 diamonds. Thus with a 10 card fit, GIB's response is correct, as per at least a couple of earlier threads of yours.

Exactly.

View Postsmerriman, on 2020-November-21, 04:32, said:

So it's the definition of 4NT that needs correcting, since it makes no sense for that to promise 3 diamonds.

Well 2 is defined as 5+ cards here, and most definitions of RKCB say that one should have a fit (hence the extra length Q show).
We sometimes use it without known fit, and alert (if appropriate) and explain that in possible situations.

The use of 5NT seems pointless, if all it could do is expose is the K as it seems.

No reason to worry about ending up in slam with this hand in any case - it's just an unlucky layout.
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#4 User is offline   nige1 

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Posted 2020-November-21, 10:03

The Possum 'Hi all. I think I am entitled to feel somewhat peeved with this, despite only having 1 diamond [I considered going to 6NT but people struggled in NT, some missed out on 6 clubs (I dont like to compete with partner) and as far as I can see if my partner had the promised Queen and the break had been 4-1 (not 5-0) it would have made 6D regards PPS Before anyone tells me - but you were committing to 6D with my 4NT, the title of my post relates to RKCB. However it was the lie about the Queen that upset me - I had other options in my mind too. Come to think of it are then any documented escapes from Blackwood or RKCB or has all the space for escaping been used up?
++++++++++++++++++++++
Perhaps, the 4N rebid was precipitate. On a different deal, it would be better to mark time with a (forcing) 3 rebid, in case partner had support. Here, however, over 3, partner would rebid 3, so all paths lead to 6. The break is unlucky but other NS pairs suffer a similar fate in this death-trap deal.:(

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#5 User is offline   smerriman 

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Posted 2020-November-21, 13:22

While a 3 rebid is clear with a human partner, the danger with GIB is that over a 3NT response, you have 0 ways to continue a slam investigation other than leaping to slam. So I sympathise with the 4NT bid. However, in reality, even if it didn't promise 3 diamonds, you would get a 5 response and be in exactly the same final contract.
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#6 User is offline   thepossum 

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Posted 2020-November-22, 20:55

Thx everyone. I realise it was something of an unusual hand but I felt there seemed a good chance of something and was actually (possibly) headed to No trumps with the right responses
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