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You are on lead. Which card would you play? Why?

#1 User is offline   arepo24 

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Posted 2020-June-15, 07:28

The opposition has bid 4 Diamonds and all have passed, without any intervening bids.
Your hand:

D: 865
S: A984
H: A782
C: K8
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#2 User is offline   nige1 

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Posted 2020-June-15, 08:56


arepo24 writes "The opposition has bid 4 Diamonds and all have passed, without any intervening bids."
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Your choice of lead will probably depend on the auction. But. OK.
Let's assume that you are West, on lead after South opened 4.
I rank
1. A. Take Rixi's advice to lead an ace against a pre--empt..
2. A. Similar reasoning.
3. K. Hoping for a ruff.
4. x. At least GIB would approve

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#3 User is offline   Vampyr 

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Posted 2020-June-15, 09:00

View Postnige1, on 2020-June-15, 08:56, said:

hv=pc=n&w=s865ha984da872ck8&d=s&v=0&b=11&a=4dppp]133|200|
arepo24 writes "The opposition has bid 4 Diamonds and all have passed, without any intervening bids."


++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Your choice of lead will probably depend on the auction. But. OK.
Let's assume that you are West, on lead after South opened 4.
I rank
1. A. Take Rixi's advice to lead an ace against a pre--empt..
2. A. Similar reasoning.
3. K. Hoping for a ruff.
4. x. At least GIB would approve ;[/hv]


I agree, except for the fact that I think the hand has been presented in jumbled-up order.
I know not with what weapons World War III will be fought, but World War IV will be fought with sticks and stones -- Albert Einstein
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#4 User is offline   Tramticket 

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Posted 2020-June-15, 12:10

View PostVampyr, on 2020-June-15, 09:00, said:

I agree, except for the fact that I think the hand has been presented in jumbled-up order.


Yes, second one in recent day: (See here).

Can I advise posters to use the hand diagram (spade symbol with two red bars to left and right).
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#5 User is offline   balasu 

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Posted 2020-June-15, 13:45

I would lead the A of hearts as a lead and survey the land before proceeding
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#6 User is offline   arepo24 

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Posted 2020-June-15, 14:25

What's wrong with leading the 8 of Trump?
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#7 User is offline   mikeh 

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Posted 2020-June-15, 15:48

View Postarepo24, on 2020-June-15, 14:25, said:

What's wrong with leading the 8 of Trump?

The trump 8, or any low card in diamonds, can win on some rare layouts. For example, if we lead the heart Ace, dummy might hit with great hearts, headed by the KQ, and declarer ruffs, and has a quick entry to dummy. So a low trump saves us from that disaster.

Im not a big fan of simulations in most contexts, but here is a situation where a simulation might help. Of course different people will differ on the constraints Does south promise 7 or 8 diamonds?

Whats the vulnerability? Which affects the constraints for 4D and may affect th3 constraints for partner who, despite being short in diamonds, passed.

Once one has agreed on constraints, then a sim may well let us evaluate the lead

Personally, I lead a heart (the ace), despite the risk of setting up dummys suit while dummy has entries (note that this is a risk even when the ace holds the trick).

I have no great confidence in this choice. About the only 2 cards I am sure are heavy losers are the diamond A and the small club.....and even they could be the winning leads😊
'one of the great markers of the advance of human kindness is the howls you will hear from the Men of God' Johann Hari
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#8 User is offline   johnu 

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Posted 2020-June-15, 16:36

View Postmikeh, on 2020-June-15, 15:48, said:

About the only 2 cards I am sure are heavy losers are the diamond A and the small club.....and even they could be the winning leads��

OP posted the suits out of order. There is no A in the hand so it can never be the "right" lead but it may have been the winning lead :)
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#9 User is offline   P_Marlowe 

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Posted 2020-June-16, 00:33

Hi,

if the hand is as in original post, I am leading a trump from xxx
if the hand is as in nige1's post, I am going with a spade, less convinced

With kind regards
Marlowe
With kind regards
Uwe Gebhardt (P_Marlowe)
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#10 User is offline   AL78 

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Posted 2020-June-16, 02:42

View Postmikeh, on 2020-June-15, 15:48, said:

For example, if we lead the heart Ace, dummy might hit with great hearts, headed by the KQ, and declarer ruffs, and has a quick entry to dummy.


That very thing happened to me once in a very similar auction.
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#11 User is offline   nekthen 

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Posted 2020-June-16, 04:28

A trump lead is dubious. If opps diamonds are solid, why did he not open 3N?
I think I try the K, the ace rates to be in dummy or with partner so may be the best chance to defeat the contract if declarer has a major void
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#12 User is offline   P_Marlowe 

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Posted 2020-June-16, 05:10

View Postnekthen, on 2020-June-16, 04:28, said:

A trump lead is dubious. If opps diamonds are solid, why did he not open 3N?
<snip>


The issue with a trump lead is, that it looses a tempo, it is the safes lead, it wont
blow tricks most of the time.
Asssuming partner has a diamond honor, it is quite likely singelton, we have 3,
opener has 7-8, now Kx with partner is possible - dummy holding 0, and in this holding
the lead costs, because there is no finesse.
With only one trump in dummy and a 71 fit missing the king, declarer may decide to give
up the finesse in order to preserve dummies entries, which again let the lead cost.

But obviously Dummy having the Ace to nothing, with opener holding Qx is not a high
probability for you.

Giving up a tempo is dangerous, but then we block all 3 suits outside trump, i.e. there are
no fast discards, ... unless we produce those fast discards.

PS: Not opening a 3NT can have various reasons, one being, it may not have be a possible option.
With kind regards
Uwe Gebhardt (P_Marlowe)
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#13 User is offline   AstridM38 

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Posted 2020-June-16, 05:10

View Postarepo24, on 2020-June-15, 07:28, said:

The opposition has bid 4 Diamonds and all have passed, without any intervening bids.
Your hand:

D: 865 5D
S: A984
H: A782
C: K8

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#14 User is offline   AstridM38 

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Posted 2020-June-16, 05:11

View Postarepo24, on 2020-June-15, 07:28, said:

The opposition has bid 4 Diamonds and all have passed, without any intervening bids.
Your hand:

D: 865
S: A984
H: A782
C: K8
6D
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#15 User is offline   miamijd 

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Posted 2020-June-16, 11:18

View Postarepo24, on 2020-June-15, 07:28, said:

The opposition has bid 4 Diamonds and all have passed, without any intervening bids.
Your hand:

D: 865
S: A984
H: A782
C: K8


I think there is some confusion. Is the hand:

A984
A872
865
K8

or is the hand:

865
A984
A872
K8
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#16 User is offline   arepo24 

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Posted 2020-June-16, 12:45

View Postmiamijd, on 2020-June-16, 11:18, said:

I think there is some confusion. Is the hand:

A984
A872
865
K8

or is the hand:

865
A984
A872
K8


The contract is 4D by opponent. I have the lead. Here are my cards as arranged in my hand to play the 4D contract:
Trumps are the first suit in my hand:
D:865 (trumps)
S:A984
H:A872
C:K8
WHAT IS MY LEAD?
Lots of responses all over the place. I would rarely lead an unsupported A in a non NT contract unless maybe the contract was in slam. Nor would I lead away from an Ace (which is even worse). As for the CK? That's obvious!
My answer: I led the Trump Diamond 8.
I could have led the trump diamond 5 but then I thought my partner might think I had a high trump card in my hand.
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#17 User is online   pescetom 

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Posted 2020-June-16, 12:52

View Postarepo24, on 2020-June-16, 12:45, said:

The contract is 4D by opponent. I have the lead. Here are my cards as arranged in my hand to play the 4D contract:
Trumps are the first suit in my hand:
D:865 (trumps)
S:A984
H:A872
C:K8



You could have avoided a lot of confusion and difficulty for everyone who reads by using the hand diagram tool, as nige1 attempted to do for you.
Using a browser it is invoked with the icon that looks like at the far right of the line of icons starting with Bold Italic Underline.
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#18 User is offline   shyams 

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Posted 2020-June-16, 12:55

... or perhaps writing the suits in the standard order ( then then then ). The fact that diamonds are trumps does not mean it has to be listed first in the order of priority.
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#19 User is offline   P_Marlowe 

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Posted 2020-June-16, 15:01

View Postarepo24, on 2020-June-16, 12:45, said:

<snip>
My answer: I led the Trump Diamond 8.
I could have led the trump diamond 5 but then I thought my partner might think I had a high trump card in my hand.

Why should the 5 promise a honor?
Either go with the card you would lead from a no trump suit, or play something like Lavianthal in the trump suit.
Leading trump tells declarer usually, how the trumps are distributed, and locates missing Queens, it also cuts down
defensive ruffs.
With kind regards
Uwe Gebhardt (P_Marlowe)
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#20 User is offline   Tramticket 

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Posted 2020-June-16, 15:53

View Postarepo24, on 2020-June-16, 12:45, said:

Here are my cards as arranged in my hand to play the 4D contract


Here are my thoughts arranged in the order of my mother's date of birth:

WHAT A SILLY POST.
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