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Robot Bidding Terrible Bidding

#1 User is offline   arunmahesh 

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Posted 2020-May-25, 05:40

The BBO robot is poorly designed. Its bidding is terrible. First, it does not follow SAYC conventions so right off the bat, most people are confused. Then it is designed for esoteric conventions which are screwy to say the least. The stupid robot competes with its partner rather than work with its partner. It will keep bidding even with an inferior hand until it reaches a contract in its suit. I come to BBO because of its excellent graphics but I am fed up.
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#2 User is offline   barmar 

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Posted 2020-May-25, 13:33

The BBO robot plays 2/1 Game Forcing, not SAYC.

Most of its bidding is pretty mainstream. The only really unusual thing it plays is after 1Major - 1NT - 2NT responder's bid is a transfer.

You can find a complete description of the robot's system at https://www.bridgeba...ystem_notes.php

#3 User is offline   jcalex2 

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Posted 2020-June-17, 15:25

View Postarunmahesh, on 2020-May-25, 05:40, said:

The BBO robot is poorly designed. Its bidding is terrible. First, it does not follow SAYC conventions so right off the bat, most people are confused. Then it is designed for esoteric conventions which are screwy to say the least. The stupid robot competes with its partner rather than work with its partner. It will keep bidding even with an inferior hand until it reaches a contract in its suit. I come to BBO because of its excellent graphics but I am fed up.


I completely agree. Although the robots do not use SAYC, I do not believe the bidding conforms to hardly any "mainstream" bidding technique as the previous reply states. This has been discussed at length and for many years. Ex: just played a hand P (robot) opened 1 D, I have approx 18 points, bid 1 S with 5 card suit, p raised to 2S. I tried to bid 4NT (BW)...could not, GIB did not recognize this as BW....Finally settled for blind bid of 6S, made it, but should have been in 6 NT. of note i hovered over 4c (looking for Gerber) and several other possible bids, none of which were reasonable explanations in this relatively common situation. You just have to learn to try to compensate for their expected responses, and look for the worst. On the other hand, their double dummy card play is superb!
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#4 User is online   smerriman 

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Posted 2020-June-17, 17:55

View Postjcalex2, on 2020-June-17, 15:25, said:

Ex: just played a hand P (robot) opened 1 D, I have approx 18 points, bid 1 S with 5 card suit, p raised to 2S. I tried to bid 4NT (BW)...could not, GIB did not recognize this as BW....Finally settled for blind bid of 6S, made it, but should have been in 6 NT. of note i hovered over 4c (looking for Gerber) and several other possible bids, none of which were reasonable explanations in this relatively common situation.

GIBs responses are perfectly normal in this situation. 4NT is definitely Blackwood; 4 is a standard splinter, a new suit is a game try (which could turn into a slam try), etc.

But perhaps you were playing Solitaire, where there have been reports of connection issues causing part of the auction to get lost, rather than related to GIB in any way.
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#5 User is online   pilowsky 

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Posted 2020-June-18, 16:49

There is absolutely nothing wrong with the BBO bidding system. If you speak English at it do not expect it to reply in Latin. That would be highly unusual. This complaint appears regularly here every time someone fails to read the GIB system notes carefully.
non est deus ex machina; även maskiner behöver lite kärlek.
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#6 User is online   smerriman 

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Posted 2020-June-18, 17:16

View Postpilowsky, on 2020-June-18, 16:49, said:

There is absolutely nothing wrong with the BBO bidding system.

Sorry, but while there is nothing wrong with the specific bids mentioned in this thread, GIB's bidding system in general is monumentally broken. While it's true a lot of people don't know the system, those that have played with GIB regularly know the vast plethora of issues with it which have been around unfixed for many years.
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#7 User is offline   sfi 

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Posted 2020-June-18, 18:12

View Postsmerriman, on 2020-June-18, 17:16, said:

Sorry, but while there is nothing wrong with the specific bids mentioned in this thread, GIB's bidding system in general is monumentally broken.

I don't think that's quite true. The system itself is ok - there are holes and it's certainly not something I would want to play IRL, but it's basically a workable system. The real issue is GIB's use of it, where it passes obviously forcing bids, doesn't give preference in clear situations, breaks its own system, shows 15+ cards, makes ridiculous decisions and so on. If you'd said "GIB's bidding in general is monumentally broken," I'd agree.
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#8 User is online   nullve 

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Posted 2020-June-19, 04:41

View Postpilowsky, on 2020-June-18, 16:49, said:

There is absolutely nothing wrong with the BBO bidding system. If you speak English at it do not expect it to reply in Latin. That would be highly unusual. This complaint appears regularly here every time someone fails to read the GIB system notes carefully.

Sometimes that "someone" is a couple of robots:

(2 = canapé preempt)

Btw, this might be the most amazing auction I've ever seen.

Edit: I was bidding this while looking at all four hands, and I guess I was too shocked to make a takeout double as North over 3. So what would have happened if I had?

God is Bidding:

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#9 User is offline   barmar 

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Posted 2020-June-19, 09:24

View Postjcalex2, on 2020-June-17, 15:25, said:

I completely agree. Although the robots do not use SAYC, I do not believe the bidding conforms to hardly any "mainstream" bidding technique as the previous reply states.

The robot system is mainly just 2/1 Game Forcing. It has a few unusual treatments and some bugs, but that's the intent.

Quote

This has been discussed at length and for many years. Ex: just played a hand P (robot) opened 1 D, I have approx 18 points, bid 1 S with 5 card suit, p raised to 2S. I tried to bid 4NT (BW)...could not, GIB did not recognize this as BW.

What did it say it was? I just performed a test and it said "Blackwood (S) -- 4+ ; 20+ total points".

We've gotten reports of some problem with bid explanations in the anonymous games. Sometimes it explains a bid as if the earlier bidding didn't occur. We haven't been able to track down the cause of this.

#10 User is offline   johnu 

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Posted 2020-June-19, 21:45

View Postnullve, on 2020-June-19, 04:41, said:

Sometimes that "someone" is a couple of robots:

(2 = canapé preempt)

Btw, this might be the most amazing auction I've ever seen.

Looks like standard Lebensohl super canape to me. Relay and play in your shortest suit. WTP? If you have a good partner, they will cover your lack of trumps.
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#11 User is offline   laboche 

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Posted 2022-August-08, 09:47

The bots are terrible. Rt opp opens 4spades . I decide to sacrifice and bid 5clubs. The stupid bot bids 6 with a lousey hand. There are so many other terrible bot actions not related to 2/1 that I've run into.Even when you check the bots bid in the explanation box, it doesn't correspond remotely to the bots actual hand. They compete rather than support. They have taken my game bid to slam that usually goes down and my part score to unmakable game. I give up. I'm sure some will defend the program and tell me to ignore my lying eyes.
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#12 User is online   smerriman 

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Posted 2022-August-08, 19:29

View Postlaboche, on 2022-August-08, 09:47, said:

I'm sure some will defend the program and tell me to ignore my lying eyes.

The bots can make some very bad bids, and there are lots of examples in this forum.

Humans playing with bots can also make some very bad bids, and think the bot has messed up when it hasn't, and there are lots of examples of that too in this forum.

Without posting specific hands, there's no way of knowing which applies to your situation, but note that even when playing with humans, you can't "sacrifice" over the opponents' preempt - overcalling shows a good hand.
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