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Bid this using Walsh system ACBL

#1 User is offline   dickiegera 

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Posted 2019-July-11, 06:37

Playing Walsh if West bids 1 East will bid 1NT.

Now what?

Maybe it is best if West bids 2 [Inverted minors]


Opinions please

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#2 User is offline   etha 

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Posted 2019-July-11, 07:41

you can just play some methods over 1nt. e.g 2 = game forcing 2= forces 2 includes all invites.


So west can bid 2 east 2. Now west can bid 3 or 3 and will eventually end up in 6 assuming all goes well.
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#3 User is offline   Cyberyeti 

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Posted 2019-July-11, 09:07

No issue for us at all, we play 2 as a fit jump,opener rebids 3 and we're off to the Wacky races, not sure what 2 is for you
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#4 User is offline   HardVector 

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Posted 2019-July-11, 20:35

This hand demonstrates why playing strong jump shifts is so valuable. Playing strong jump shifts, you just bid 2d the first time. If you are playing that bid as weak, your system MUST incorporate some way of showing this kind of hand. XYZ/Modified 2-way stayman is one way to do that. If you are unwilling to learn some complicated convention, then go back to strong jump shifts. If you don't know what strong jump shifts are, get a bidding book written by Charles Goren, it will explain it.
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#5 User is offline   igt3 

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Posted 2019-July-12, 01:35

2 would deny, maybe not 4 diamonds, but 5. Specially in an unbalanced hand.
I think game forcing jump shifts are a little bit better than weak, so with my partner I bid 2. What I really want, specially in MP, is to play 6NT from west. Might be hard though. What do I do after 1-1-1? If you play 1 as 4th suit forcing I can bid that and then maybe jump in diamonds whatever partner says.
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#6 User is offline   P_Marlowe 

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Posted 2019-July-12, 02:28

Hi,

what is wrong with 3H in response to 1NT?

Playing walsh, 2H would show 5+D and 4+H and gf values, so why should
3H not be a auto splinter?

With kind regards
Marlowe
With kind regards
Uwe Gebhardt (P_Marlowe)
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#7 User is online   heart76 

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Posted 2019-July-12, 05:26

View Postigt3, on 2019-July-12, 01:35, said:

2 would deny, maybe not 4 diamonds, but 5. Specially in an unbalanced hand.
I think game forcing jump shifts are a little bit better than weak, so with my partner I bid 2. What I really want, specially in MP, is to play 6NT from west. Might be hard though. What do I do after 1-1-1? If you play 1 as 4th suit forcing I can bid that and then maybe jump in diamonds whatever partner says.


The question was about Walsh, so opener rebids 1NT.
Also, why would you jump after 4sf?

XYNT, described in an earlier post, is mandatory with Walsh.
1C - 1D / 1NT -2D / 2H - 3C shows already a5-4, otherwise responder bids a 2C inverted minor raise.
Opener should now show his 3 cards D with 3D, since partner needs to be interested in more than 3NT for his 3C bid. Than every pair would have their methods to invite slam, e.g. 4D or 4H kickback.
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#8 User is offline   nekthen 

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Posted 2019-July-12, 05:28

I think 2 is most useful to show a weak hand with 5 and 4, then the sequence 1 1 1N 2 can be 55 (still weak as 2 and 2 are available to show invites and GF hands.

As already mentioned 1 1 1N 2 (GF) 2 3 is the way to start
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#9 User is offline   Left2Right 

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Posted 2019-July-12, 11:59

I asked Rhoda Walsh, a pen pal of mine, whether she and the late Paul Soloway put the Soloway Jump Shift on their convention card when the two of them were partners. She replied in the negative.

That's rather telling when the inventor of a convention and a top expert partner forgo using his own invention.

But let's cover first things first: The value of the hand. After all, if you don't know the true playing value of the hand, how can you be expected to find the right bid for it.

Since a splinter on the first round would agree clubs (opener's suit), West's first call is 1. After the anointed Walsh rebid, 1NT, a vanilla jump shift into three clubs forces to game and promices 5+ diamonds and 4+ clubs. East takes the obvious preference for diamonds and promises three of them (because West need not have more than five diamond cards).

This support yields two critical things: 1) West is the captain because East has limited his hand (12-14); and 2) West's ability to correctly revalue his hand for Responder Count. Rhoda call's it PSP (Partnership Support Points) but a rose by any other name.

Valuing your hand in the 19-21 point range, facing a partner who has an opening hand usually yields a slam unless you are unlucky with the slam controls. And away you go toward slam.
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#10 User is offline   nige1 

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Posted 2019-July-12, 12:22



dickiegera 'Playing Walsh if West bids 1 East will bid 1NT.Now what?Maybe it is best if West bids 2 [Inverted minors]. Opinions please'

++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
To 1. if you reply 2 (inverted) rather than 1/2. then you are likely to lose the suit.
Perhaps, best to agree Transfers, Crowhurst, 2-way check-back, or XYZ, as a solution to this kind of problem.

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#11 User is offline   Cyberyeti 

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Posted 2019-July-12, 12:39

View PostLeft2Right, on 2019-July-12, 11:59, said:

I asked Rhoda Walsh, a pen pal of mine, whether she and the late Paul Soloway put the Soloway Jump Shift on their convention card when the two of them were partners. She replied in the negative.

That's rather telling when the inventor of a convention and a top expert partner forgo using his own invention.



Better than Ghestem putting his convention on his card ... and forgetting it
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#12 User is offline   dsLawsd 

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Posted 2019-July-12, 12:44

I think 2 because of suit quality and strength if playing strong jump shifts.

Grant Baze is really the main source of Soloway jumps shifts which came later: his notes show this with follow-ups.

2really should show 5 pieces unless solid.

If no strong jump available there is no reason not to just bid 1 to start thus saving space.

Other systems with XYZ would not apply in the Walsh context.
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#13 User is offline   pescetom 

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Posted 2019-July-12, 14:33

View PostCyberyeti, on 2019-July-12, 12:39, said:

Better than Ghestem putting his convention on his card ... and forgetting it


But as I read, he had forgotten that he had "agreed" to play it, not how to play it... suggesting that he no longer considered it highly.
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#14 User is offline   Phil 

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Posted 2019-July-13, 17:46

I'd probably bid:

1 1
1N 3
3N Pass (?)

Obviously 6 is great and 3N by East is in jeopardy.
Hi y'all!

Winner - BBO Challenge bracket #6 - February, 2017.
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