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pre-balancing with bad 5-card suit

Poll: pre-balancing with bad 5-card suit (14 member(s) have cast votes)

Which of the following choices are reasonable?

  1. Pass (7 votes [38.89%] - View)

    Percentage of vote: 38.89%

  2. dbl (9 votes [50.00%] - View)

    Percentage of vote: 50.00%

  3. 2Sp (2 votes [11.11%] - View)

    Percentage of vote: 11.11%

  4. Other (0 votes [0.00%])

    Percentage of vote: 0.00%

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#1 User is online   helene_t 

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Posted 2019-February-26, 20:50

Matchpoints, red vs white. RHO deals and opens 1NT (12-14)
(1NT)-p-(2)-p
(2-?

You hold
9xxxx
x
AQJx
KTx

As you don't have any conventions to distinguish five spades from six, you pass in first round.

I suppose you could have asked opps if they regularly open 1NT with a 5-card major, and if they play smolen or crawling stayman, but this is the local club so you assume the answer to the first two questions would be "no" and to the third probably "no agreement".
The world would be such a happy place, if only everyone played Acol :) --- TramTicket
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#2 User is online   sfi 

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Posted 2019-February-26, 20:54

Given the poll question, is it still possible to allow people to choose more than one answer?
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#3 User is offline   sacto123 

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Posted 2019-February-26, 23:16

View Posthelene_t, on 2019-February-26, 20:50, said:

Matchpoints, red vs white. RHO deals and opens 1NT (12-14)
(1NT)-p-(2)-p
(2-?

You hold
9xxxx
x
AQJx
KTx

As you don't have any conventions to distinguish five spades from six, you pass in first round.

I suppose you could have asked opps if they regularly open 1NT with a 5-card major, and if they play smolen or crawling stayman, but this is the local club so you assume the answer to the first two questions would be "no" and to the third probably "no agreement".

Perhaps I am to cautious, but I don't see this as "pre-balancing". LHO's hand has not been limited, so you have no reason to believe that partner has any useful cards. You could be walking into a huge minus score.
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#4 User is offline   cherdano 

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Posted 2019-February-26, 23:35

Not sure what I hate more - pass or "other".
The easiest way to count losers is to line up the people who talk about loser count, and count them. -Kieran Dyke
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#5 User is online   helene_t 

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Posted 2019-February-27, 00:36

View Postsfi, on 2019-February-26, 20:54, said:

Given the poll question, is it still possible to allow people to choose more than one answer?

Oops sorry, corrected. Now you can :)
The world would be such a happy place, if only everyone played Acol :) --- TramTicket
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#6 User is online   sfi 

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Posted 2019-February-27, 02:56

View Posthelene_t, on 2019-February-27, 00:36, said:

Oops sorry, corrected. Now you can :)


Much better, although I no longer have that excuse to procrastinate. 😀
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#7 User is offline   mcphee 

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Posted 2019-February-27, 04:52

there is some good news for me when I dble, it's pairs. You pray the great shuffler will remain kind and not give you the zero you may well get. I know my dble carries risk, if I pass and so does next hand we are playing for +50s' because partner is passing.
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#8 User is offline   wank 

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Posted 2019-February-27, 05:24

if my partner passed, i'd be calling him an ambulance.
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#9 User is offline   Tramticket 

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Posted 2019-February-27, 06:05

Bidding 2 has little going for it. I find that opps are bidding on three quarters of the time - so you don't want to suggest a lead. Also, there is no reason to think that opps have more than a seven-card fit and competent opps will be able to double if appropriate (yes, I know you said it was a local club ...).

Much safer to double.
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#10 User is offline   Cyberyeti 

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Posted 2019-February-27, 06:23

If I was going to get into this auction, I'd have done so with "spades and another" directly. You could try a double now, but don't be surprised if LHO who was about to bid 3N redoubles and you're heading on to a disaster.
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#11 User is offline   eagles123 

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Posted 2019-February-27, 07:06

nothing other than X would occur to me i have to say
"definitely that's what I like to play when I'm playing standard - I want to be able to bid diamonds because bidding good suits is important in bridge" - Meckstroth's opinion on weak 2 diamond
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#12 User is offline   Tramticket 

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Posted 2019-February-27, 08:43

View PostCyberyeti, on 2019-February-27, 06:23, said:

If I was going to get into this auction, I'd have done so with "spades and another" directly.


This is better than bidding 2 now. But you are still very likely to be defending with an unhelpful spade lead.
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#13 User is offline   Cyberyeti 

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Posted 2019-February-27, 09:10

View PostTramticket, on 2019-February-27, 08:43, said:

This is better than bidding 2 now. But you are still very likely to be defending with an unhelpful spade lead.


Sometimes, but partner often tries to hit your minor unless short in spades and looking for a ruff.
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#14 User is offline   HardVector 

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Posted 2019-February-27, 11:55

So, for everyone wanting to take some action, what contract are they going to play in? 2h...4h...3m...3N? You have no idea. If they play in hearts, do they have a fit? What is you partner going to do if you pull a 2h contract in which they have 5 decent hearts to play in the mess you have? If they play in 3n, what is a spade lead going to do? Additionally, you are potentially turning a -110 or -140 into a real number...for them. Finally, going forward, you partner will never trust your bids to mean anything in the future, so if you get a decent playing hand that actually should take some action, your partner is going to do the wrong thing.

The glass looks half empty and my rose colored glasses are broke.
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#15 User is offline   cherdano 

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Posted 2019-February-27, 13:36

View PostTramticket, on 2019-February-27, 06:05, said:

Bidding 2 has little going for it. I find that opps are bidding on three quarters of the time - so you don't want to suggest a lead.

What are the odds that partner will be on lead? I don't think they will play in diamonds or spades, so the only remaining possible strain where partner is on lead is clubs...
The easiest way to count losers is to line up the people who talk about loser count, and count them. -Kieran Dyke
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#16 User is online   helene_t 

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Posted 2019-February-27, 18:45

Thanks all.

I doubled, partner had a weak 2434. 3-4, not doubled but a bottom nonetheless.
The world would be such a happy place, if only everyone played Acol :) --- TramTicket
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