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How do you bid this grand slam?

#1 User is offline   Dinarius 

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Posted 2018-April-13, 07:55



East passes as Dealer.

Whatever you open as South, West passes.

How do you get to 7?

D.
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#2 User is online   Cyberyeti 

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Posted 2018-April-13, 08:12

1-2N(good raise to 3 or better, 4+)
3(LSGT initially)-4
5-5
5-6
7

Not ideal, partner's spades might be worse than this but not by much in that he doesn't appear to have AK and 6 sounds more enthusiastic than other things he could have done.

**edit, actually it occurs to me that 3N showing 4333 and enough for game is a better bid than 4, now 5 is exclusion and the auction continues 5(1)-5N(Q?)-6(yes+K)-6(bid 7 with the K or Q)-7**

Another way we could have bid it:

1-2N
4(voidwood)-4(1/4)
4N(Q?)-5(yes +K)
5(I have one of K/Q bid 7 with the other)-7
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#3 User is offline   fromageGB 

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Posted 2018-April-13, 08:31

This one is easy.

1 - 2NT (13+hcp, 4+)
5 (15+ hcp, void, "ace" ask) - 5 (2 of AKQAA)
5NT (>5, so confirming all of AKQAA, and grand slam desire as prelude to K discovery) - 7 (ignoring the king process)

Responder has both of the side Ks, can see a minimum of 28 out of a 30 point pack.

(Edit - see post #8)

This post has been edited by fromageGB: 2018-April-13, 21:29

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#4 User is offline   FelicityR 

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Posted 2018-April-13, 09:39

With my experienced Acol partner.

1 - 3NT (pudding raise 4 balanced 13-15)
4 - 4
4 - 4
5 - 5
5NT - 7

Control cue-bidding after 3NT, and 5NT being Josephine - bid 7 with two of top three honours.
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#5 User is offline   Dinarius 

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Posted 2018-April-13, 10:50

Felicity,

Is 4♣️ Exclusion Blackwood? If so, I presume that 4♦️ is 1/4 and 4❤️ is Queen asking? Sorry if Iím misunderstanding the sequence.

Whatever, I donít think it can be bid without Ex. Blackwood.

1♠️ 2NT
4♣️ 4♦️ 1/4
4❤️ (Q?) 5♦️ (Q + ♦️K)
5NT (GSF) 7♠️

In this sequence, ❤️K isnít established. But, the ♦️K is the gold card. So, maybe itís worth a punt?

D.
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#6 User is offline   rmnka447 

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Posted 2018-April-13, 11:22

Holding a 4 QT, 4 loser hand opposite a forcing game raise, there's no reason not to show your second suit.

1 - 2 NT(Jacoby)
4 - 4 (cue)
5 - 5
5 NT - 7

5 NT= GSF

After the 4 bid, responder knows all his/her pointed suit points are golden because opener has shown at least a good 5-5 hand. Those cards are likely solidifying the suits for 10 pretty sure tricks. At worst, the K might need to be onside to ensure 11 tricks in 5 . After the 2 cues by responder, 7 simply depends on high trump honors in responder's hand.
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#7 User is offline   Dinarius 

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Posted 2018-April-13, 11:53

Interesting to bypass the ♣️ control/void and show the ♦️ control first.

D.
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#8 User is offline   fromageGB 

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Posted 2018-April-13, 21:27

(see post #3)

1 - 2NT
5 - 5
6 - 7

In post #3 I described 5NT as a "positive" bid to avoid explanations, but in truth I use it as a "negative". By bidding beyond 5 you confirm you have all the 6 crucial cards AKQAAA (except here clubs are excluded). 5NT is used as control to enable the partnership to stop in 6 even if all kings are held. As I play denial kings, I play denial 5NT, and it denies the desire to be in a grand even if all side kings are held, unless partner can contribute a trick I do not expect. Bypassing 5NT as the strong asker means you have that desire - in the same way that bypassing a suit means you have that K, when playing denial kings.

(If it was the weaker (teller) hand to bid or bypass 5NT, bidding denies the ability to contribute an unexexpected trick even if all kings are held.)

Here asker has a completely solid hand, should teller have the two missing kings, so is very happy to say this by bypassing 5NT and bidding 6 to deny that king.

Teller bids 7 because he has that king, has the other side king, and asker has told him to bid 7 if all kings are held.
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#9 User is online   neilkaz 

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Posted 2018-April-13, 23:28

View PostDinarius, on 2018-April-13, 11:53, said:

Interesting to bypass the ♣️ control/void and show the ♦️ control first.

D.


if you're referring to rmnka's post. The classical way in these parts is to respond to Jacoby 2NT is that 4 shows a very good 2nd suit. For me this is a rare bid and requires a 5 card suit with two of the top 3 honors, making the fitting 3rd honor gold when it comes to making a slam.
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#10 User is offline   rmnka447 

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Posted 2018-April-14, 00:18

View PostDinarius, on 2018-April-13, 11:53, said:

Interesting to bypass the ♣️ control/void and show the ♦️ control first.

D.


Showing at least 5-5, responder knows there's likely to be shortness somewhere as only 3 or less other cards need to be defined in the hand. A shortness bid shows the shortness, but that potentially just defines 6 cards in opener's hand -- a stiff and 5 trumps. In regular Jacoby you show shortness with a 3 bid over the 2 NT bid and that's the path you'd take with a poorer suit.
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#11 User is offline   PhilG007 

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Posted 2018-April-14, 00:37

1 4
5NT(grand slam force)
7 (KQ held)
Short and sweet replacing a funny old muddle of the previous posts(!) Posted Image
"It is not enough to be a good player, you must also play well"
- Dr Tarrasch(1862-1934)German Chess Grandmaster

Bridge is a game where you have two opponents...and often three(!)


"Any palooka can take tricks with Aces and Kings; the true expert shows his prowess
by how he handles the two's and three's" - Mollo's Hideous Hog
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#12 User is offline   FelicityR 

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Posted 2018-April-14, 01:00

View PostPhilG007, on 2018-April-14, 00:37, said:

1 4
5NT(grand slam force)
7 (KQ held)
Short and sweet replacing a funny old muddle of the previous posts(!) Posted Image


As the tennis player, John McEnroe, used to say "You cannot be serious".
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#13 User is offline   cleveritis 

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Posted 2018-April-14, 01:47

View PostDinarius, on 2018-April-13, 07:55, said:



East passes as Dealer.

Whatever you open as South, West passes.

How do you get to 7?

D.


1S - 2N (gf 4 spades) - 3c short clubs - 4c (holy shtt are you kidding? shows all stuff outside clubs) - 4D (q), 4s (ive said it all), 5C (club control, 5D (ok ok i will help), 5N gsf - 7s
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#14 User is online   Cyberyeti 

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Posted 2018-April-14, 02:19

View PostPhilG007, on 2018-April-14, 00:37, said:

1 4
5NT(grand slam force)
7 (KQ held)
Short and sweet replacing a funny old muddle of the previous posts(!) Posted Image


Another ridiculous post by this author, partner held the same hand with the minors the other way round, the grand was almost no play (KJ doubleton onside required).
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#15 User is offline   sfi 

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Posted 2018-April-14, 02:30

View PostFelicityR, on 2018-April-14, 01:00, said:

As the tennis player, John McEnroe, used to say "You cannot be serious".


He isn't - it's safest just to ignore him.
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#16 User is offline   Dinarius 

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Posted 2018-April-14, 06:57

View PostCyberyeti, on 2018-April-14, 02:19, said:

Another ridiculous post by this author, partner held the same hand with the minors the other way round, the grand was almost no play (KJ doubleton onside required).


A very good point. Reverse Northís minor suit holdings, and youíre happy with game, or maybe six Spades on a lucky day.

Which makes me wonder, is it better to first tell North you hold nothing in ♣️ (And therefore have no interest in anything he might hold) rather than tell him about your ♦️ holding, as one respondent did? Isnít N in a better position to evaluate his hand once he knows from the off that ♣️ are out of the reckoning?

D.
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#17 User is online   Cyberyeti 

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Posted 2018-April-14, 07:43

View PostDinarius, on 2018-April-14, 06:57, said:

A very good point. Reverse Northís minor suit holdings, and youíre happy with game, or maybe six Spades on a lucky day.

Which makes me wonder, is it better to first tell North you hold nothing in ♣️ (And therefore have no interest in anything he might hold) rather than tell him about your ♦️ holding, as one respondent did? Isnít N in a better position to evaluate his hand once he knows from the off that ♣️ are out of the reckoning?

D.


N should not be evaluating much, he can tell S about the key features of his hand and let S do the evaluating. Flat 13 4 spades, KQ K K can be transmitted in many auctions.

I happen to play the other way round to most people, 3 of a suit being long, 4 being short over 1-2N, but it can be handled either way. Scanian responses where I believe you can show the void also work.
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#18 User is offline   case_no_6 

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Posted 2018-April-14, 11:13

Assuming that expert standard methods are being used, it is challenging but possible to reach 7S.

1S - 2N
3C - 3S
4C - 4D
4H - 5H
5N - 7S
Pass

Note that I am assuming that opener does not rebid 4D to show a 5-5. It is not that I do not like this approach, but rather that I believe that to make this bid both suits need to feature good quality suits. (The failure to bid 4C to show a void confirms I assumed the 5-5 jump bid approach.)

Thus 3C showed shortness, 3S showed no cue bid available and is waiting - one should not sign-off in 4S with such excellent trumps and welcome news about such useful shortness - and now opener's 4C confirms a club void. Now it is easy for responder to cue bid Kings having denied a red suit Ace with 3S. After responder's 5H bid, all that needs to be done is to check for trump suit quality with 5NT.
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#19 User is offline   msjennifer 

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Posted 2018-April-14, 13:14

1S-3NT,4NT-5C,5D-5NT,,7S. 3NT showed a 13/15 ,4333 hand with at least two of the 3top honors in spades,4NT is Simple Exclusion Blackwood.5C denied any Ace,5D was Spiral asking for Kings down the ladder 5NT showed the Heart King and the Diamond King and denied the club King. 7S said thank you ,I know all.The 3NT bid has been taken from Super Precision.
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#20 User is offline   miamijd 

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Posted 2018-April-14, 17:07

1S. 2nt(1)
3c(2). 3s(3)
4c(4). 4d(5)
4nt(6). 5d(7)
5h(8). 6h (9)
7s

(1). Forcing 4 card raise
(2) 0-1 clubs
(3) not a great hand but does have first or second round control of one or both reds. If you had a better hand you'd cue bid. If you didn't have first or second round control of either red you'd bid 4s with a min
(4) I will assume non serious 3nt. If serious 3nt you make that call here. With non serious 4c shows a void or stiff ace as you have already shown a stiff
(5) first or second round d control
(6) now becomes exclusion key card as you've shown the void c
(7) one
(8) queen ask
(9) queen plus Kh. You've already shown Kd so you don't show it again

Don't bid this way with GIB.

Cheers
Mike
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