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Offended or not? Opponent commrnt

#1 User is offline   zgrywus 

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Posted 2017-February-26, 20:23

Hi, I was playing one of free tournaments, (I think it's does'n matter which one, after one of the board, my righty said: "******→Stół: am I dumb...". Now plse judge if my comment was rude/funny:→Stół: tell us something we don't know..
Than I was accoused for calling the payer "a dumb", withdrown from the tournaent.
Should I feel myself guilty,or just give a s... of it? (not suopporter of political correctness).
Real name of my opponent is hidden couse it's not relevant to the case.
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#2 User is offline   barmar 

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Posted 2017-February-26, 21:04

When someone makes a self-deprecating statement, it's still a bit rude to openly agree with them. It's not as bad as calling them dumb yourself, but it's not necessary rub it in.

#3 User is offline   zgrywus 

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Posted 2017-February-26, 21:51

View Postbarmar, on 2017-February-26, 21:04, said:

When someone makes a self-deprecating statement, it's still a bit rude to openly agree with them. It's not as bad as calling them dumb yourself, but it's not necessary rub it in.

Do not agree, whenn somebidy says/freely admits he/she a dunmb ass, he/she is. Period. Might discuss why he/she is a one, but;s not the subject.
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#4 User is offline   Vampyr 

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Posted 2017-February-26, 22:06

View Postzgrywus, on 2017-February-26, 21:51, said:

Do not agree, whenn somebidy says/freely admits he/she a dunmb ass, he/she is. Period. Might discuss why he/she is a one, but;s not the subject.


Then why did you ask? You seem proud of your unkindness.
I know not with what weapons World War III will be fought, but World War IV will be fought with sticks and stones -- Albert Einstein
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#5 User is offline   zgrywus 

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Posted 2017-February-26, 22:07

View Postzgrywus, on 2017-February-26, 21:51, said:

Do not agree, whenn somebidy says/freely admits he/she a dunmb ass, he/she is. Period. Might discuss why he/she is a one, but;s not the subject.
A while latter I said following: (Just kidding,no offence), td makes no incestigation, but withdraw me from the tournament.
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#6 User is offline   zgrywus 

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Posted 2017-February-26, 22:14

View PostVampyr, on 2017-February-26, 22:06, said:

Then why did you ask? You seem proud of your unkindness.

Of course I'm, praud, praud, praud. I do not think it was "unkindeness", but a funny comment. Fell free to judge..
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#7 User is offline   barmar 

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Posted 2017-February-26, 22:24

View Postzgrywus, on 2017-February-26, 22:07, said:

A while latter I said following: (Just kidding,no offence), td makes no incestigation, but withdraw me from the tournament.

You may be able to get away with something like this with friends, with whom joking insults may be part of your regular rapport. But with strangers, you have to be more careful. Saying "just kidding" doesn't make up for the offense.

The Laws of Duplicate Bridge specifically say that you should avoid this type of behavior:

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Law 74A2:
A player should carefully avoid any remark or action that might cause annoyance or embarrassment to another player or might interfere with the enjoyment of the game.


#8 User is offline   zgrywus 

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Posted 2017-February-26, 22:41

Agree whatever U say. There were not my intention to offence any player. What I just did was to follow opponent remark, in a way I found funny. Nickname reserve it's rights.
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#9 User is offline   diana_eva 

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Posted 2017-February-27, 02:02

View Postzgrywus, on 2017-February-26, 22:41, said:

Agree whatever U say. There were not my intention to offence any player. What I just did was to follow opponent remark, in a way I found funny. Nickname reserve it's rights.


Written jokes can come out the wrong way. Maybe live you could have gotten away without upsetting anyone, with mimic and body language to support that it's just a joke. In general if you have an opponent upset over his/her own dumbness they're not gonna find it funny that you interfere and rub the salt even if you feel all jovial and relaxed. So your joke came out the wrong way, apologize sincerely, don't insist it was a good joke because it clearly wasn't taken that way.

#10 User is offline   Trinidad 

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Posted 2017-February-27, 05:41

An additional problem is that we all have to tell and understand these jokes in English. For many of us, English is not our native language.

Telling jokes and understanding jokes in a foreign language is one of the very hardest parts. There are many people who are so fluent in a foreign language that they can speak it in public, can talk it over the phone or use it to deal with complex subjects (science, culture, etc.), but they cannot communicate or understand humor in the foreign language.

And then I haven't even said anything about the fact that there are also cultural issues. What is funny in one culture can be considered horrible or distasteful in another. (You can tell that even in different cultures within one country: You wouldn't tell your mother-in-law the same jokes as you are telling your drinking buddies.)

So, my advice to you is: be very careful with humor. Treat unknown people like you would treat your mother-in-law. And at the bridge table:

Have fun, but don't be funny.

Rik
I want my opponents to leave my table with a smile on their face and without matchpoints on their score card - in that order.
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#11 User is offline   jogs 

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Posted 2017-February-27, 09:02

I'm totally anti-PC and I still think you were out of line.
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#12 User is offline   WellSpyder 

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Posted 2017-February-27, 09:44

View Postjogs, on 2017-February-27, 09:02, said:

I'm totally anti-PC and I still think you were out of line.

I don't think the remark was particularly out of line, and in the right context I think it might have been seen as amusing. The difficulty, of course, as Trinidad points out, is knowing whether or not this was the right context. I can think of at least one partner I play with with whom such banter would be regarded as entirely normal and appropriate - indeed I would be rather surprised not to get a retort along these lines! But you have no way of knowing whether people will see things the same way in an online context. One solution is obviously Trinidad's solution of having fun but not trying to be funny. I'm not sure that will always be necessary. But if you do want to risk a joke along these lines, then I think you should be ready to apologise quickly if you realise that others do not have the same attitude to banter as you do.
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#13 User is offline   gszes 

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Posted 2017-February-27, 19:46

The world is filled with people that are filled with self importance and/or impaired judgement (for any number of reasons). There will be those that literally dream up things that are wrong with almost any comment whatsoever--

In order to not get involved with these touchy feely situations it is probably best to try and keep comments to a minimum.
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#14 User is offline   barmar 

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Posted 2017-February-28, 10:49

And as someone said above, nuance is hard to recognize in online chat. The best you can do is put a smiley after your comment, but that may not be enough to mitigate the offense.

#15 User is offline   zgrywus 

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Posted 2017-February-28, 14:37

Thanks for comments, appreciate all of them. What I realized is that sense of humor is a very sensitive matter. When I saw a self-comment like "am I dumb..." I was sure it was not what the player meant, he/she was trying to excuse unlucky/bad play in funny way.
That was why, I felt myself authorised to comment following the line.
As already stated, it was not my intention to be offensive,(malicious at last, but not offensive).
Thanks for opening my eyes. I will send my deepest apologies to the player (unless I'm blacklisted by her/him - then my message will be ignored).
Finally let me say something you have already known: Am I dumb...
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#16 User is offline   barmar 

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Posted 2017-February-28, 14:53

View Postzgrywus, on 2017-February-28, 14:37, said:

Finally let me say something you have already known: Am I dumb...

No, just inexperienced.

#17 User is offline   Zelandakh 

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Posted 2017-March-07, 04:42

View Postzgrywus, on 2017-February-28, 14:37, said:

Am I dumb...

Just one final point on this. Dumb is a term that refers to people that are unable to speak. There was once a time when people with a physical disability were regarded as automatically stupid, hence the term spilled over into this other meaning. One would hope that noone still thinks that way and that it is recognised that being unable to talk in no way affects an individual's mental faculties. The reason for all of this context is to show you why many would regard the usage of the word dumb to mean stupid as highly offensive, of a similar order to the N word for those of North-West African origin.

Thus far I have not seen evidence that you are stupid. Thoughtless perhaps and certainly lacking in knowledge of the subtleties of a foreign language. I imagine most people here would need to get to know you better to make a more detailed analysis than this. Perhaps you will stay and post some more in other threads...
(-: Zel :-)
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#18 User is offline   barmar 

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Posted 2017-March-07, 09:59

View PostZelandakh, on 2017-March-07, 04:42, said:

Just one final point on this. Dumb is a term that refers to people that are unable to speak. There was once a time when people with a physical disability were regarded as automatically stupid, hence the term spilled over into this other meaning. One would hope that noone still thinks that way and that it is recognised that being unable to talk in no way affects an individual's mental faculties. The reason for all of this context is to show you why many would regard the usage of the word dumb to mean stupid as highly offensive, of a similar order to the N word for those of North-West African origin.

In America at least, "dumb" is far more often used in its informal meaning of "stupid" than to refer to people who are unable to speak.

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Thus far I have not seen evidence that you are stupid.

I think he was trying more self-deprecating sarcasm, but you demonstrated again how humor can miss the mark on the Internet.

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