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points schmoints

#1 User is offline   wank 

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Posted 2015-September-13, 14:24



1c is in a 5542 weak nt base, so often a 15-17 nt

Noone vul, imps.
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#2 User is offline   gszes 

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Posted 2015-September-13, 14:44

since I play 4c there as majors I will use that --- W/o that convention this is just a guesswork situation and good luck
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#3 User is offline   Cameron_1 

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Posted 2015-September-14, 14:14

View Postwank, on 2015-September-13, 14:24, said:



1c is in a 5542 weak nt base, so often a 15-17 nt

Noone vul, imps.

I said X ... Which worked well up until .... I failed to pull x of 5c which is equally part of the problem
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#4 User is offline   helene_t 

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Posted 2015-September-14, 14:23

I would take 4!c as diamond support so I ust bid 3!s
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#5 User is offline   mikeh 

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Posted 2015-September-14, 23:02

In real life I pass these hands. I can see all kinds of horrible results looming if I bid. However, I am gradually persuading myself that such pessimism leads to missing some great scores as well. Life is inherently dangerous (in fact, it is invariably fatal), so I think it best to bid 3S. I will pass a double of 5C without too many misgivings, and bid 4H if the occasion arises. If I do this enough here, maybe I'll start doing it at the table :D

The responsive double may well be passed out, and this hand will be a defensive disappointment to partner. He'll sympathize with bidding 3S but not doubling.
'one of the great markers of the advance of human kindness is the howls you will hear from the Men of God' Johann Hari
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#6 User is offline   Fluffy 

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Posted 2015-September-15, 09:55

I sympathize with everythig, everything can be a big disaster and also a potential winner.

I would try 3, but problem would be even worse had partner been the opener since I have nothing resembling the values of a new suit at the 3 level opposite an opening.
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#7 User is offline   mikeh 

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Posted 2015-September-15, 10:07

View PostFluffy, on 2015-September-15, 09:55, said:

I sympathize with everythig, everything can be a big disaster and also a potential winner.

I think 4M is weaker than 3M so jumping to 4 has a lot of appeal to me.

I think the main problem is that 4M is somewhat committal :D

We have good reason to suspect that partner is short in at least one major. This isn't ironclad, but he rates to have a good hand yet didn't double or overcall 1N, and while that could be because he lacks the strength to do so, it could well be that it is because he lacks the shape to do so. If LHO passes 3, then I predict that partner will either raise (good) or bid 3N or 4, which may be good or bad, but which allows us to bid 4, possibly landing on our feet or even hitting a home run.

I think it to be imperative that we do our best to find our best fit, assuming that we have one (my partners usually hold 10 or 11 cards in the minors when I hold this hand :P )
'one of the great markers of the advance of human kindness is the howls you will hear from the Men of God' Johann Hari
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#8 User is offline   MrAce 

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Posted 2015-September-15, 15:38

Call me point schmoint. I'd probably pass.
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#9 User is offline   wank 

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Posted 2015-September-19, 13:55

Partner has akxx j kjtxx kxx. You make 4s easily and 5 if you guess well. Opps make 10 in clubs. I don't think p can be blamed for passing out 3c.
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#10 User is offline   Fluffy 

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Posted 2015-September-20, 23:50

View Postmikeh, on 2015-September-15, 10:07, said:

I think the main problem is that 4M is somewhat committal :D

We have good reason to suspect that partner is short in at least one major. This isn't ironclad, but he rates to have a good hand yet didn't double or overcall 1N, and while that could be because he lacks the strength to do so, it could well be that it is because he lacks the shape to do so. If LHO passes 3, then I predict that partner will either raise (good) or bid 3N or 4, which may be good or bad, but which allows us to bid 4, possibly landing on our feet or even hitting a home run.

I think it to be imperative that we do our best to find our best fit, assuming that we have one (my partners usually hold 10 or 11 cards in the minors when I hold this hand :P )


Yes, I though partner had opened not overcalled. I was scared of a 3 forcing showing too much values, and inducing partner to go too high no matter what. You catched me very quickly I was already edditing :)
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#11 User is offline   MrAce 

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Posted 2015-September-22, 23:55

View Postwank, on 2015-September-19, 13:55, said:

Partner has akxx j kjtxx kxx. You make 4s easily and 5 if you guess well. Opps make 10 in clubs. I don't think p can be blamed for passing out 3c.


No he can not be blamed.
"Genius has its own limitations, however stupidity has no such boundaries!"
"It's only when a mosquito lands on your testicles that you realize there is always a way to solve problems without using violence!"

"Well to be perfectly honest, in my humble opinion, of course without offending anyone who thinks differently from my point of view, but also by looking into this matter in a different perspective and without being condemning of one's view's and by trying to make it objectified, and by considering each and every one's valid opinion, I honestly believe that I completely forgot what I was going to say."





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#12 User is offline   steve2005 

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Posted 2015-September-23, 11:05

View PostCameron_1, on 2015-September-14, 14:14, said:

I said X ... Which worked well up until .... I failed to pull x of 5c which is equally part of the problem

This hand screams for playing it in a major. The problem is you make any noise on this hand, partner is gonna take you for some values which you don't have. So when partner makes a penalty double say; your gonna pull even when it was gonna be juicy. Partner may also start looking or drag you to slam. You pays your money and take your chances.
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#13 User is offline   jogs 

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Posted 2015-September-23, 11:53

View Poststeve2005, on 2015-September-23, 11:05, said:

This hand screams for playing it in a major. The problem is you make any noise on this hand, partner is gonna take you for some values which you don't have.


Doesn't anyone ever wonder why opponents are bidding so much?
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#14 User is offline   jogs 

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Posted 2015-September-26, 19:46

Points schmoints. 6-5 come alive. This hand is 6-6. In the old days there was a quaint notion that one needed values for a free bid. Today we know those values disappear into opponents' voids. Only require values when one is flat. Flat pattern is defined as one without singletons or voids. Free bids require offensive values. Makes no promises on defense.


Helgemo held this in the Vanderbilt.



Now what should Helgemo lead?
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