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Another weak nt question

#1 User is offline   jillybean 

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Posted 2015-September-13, 10:40



MP 12-14 nt

Your are south, please explain your next call.
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#2 User is offline   nige1 

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Posted 2015-September-13, 11:16


jillybean asks "MP 12-14 nt. You are south, please explain your next call."

I rank
1. Pass. Especially NV at MPs. If partner has 9+ HCP, he might reply at 2-level.
2. 2N. Both majors stopped and a likely fit (but at MPs, minus scores are bad).

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#3 User is offline   mgoetze 

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Posted 2015-September-13, 12:24

View Postnige1, on 2015-September-13, 11:16, said:

If partner has 9+ HCP, he might reply at 2-level.

Is it mandatory to play extra-weak ACOL-style 2/1s when playing weak NT?
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#4 User is offline   Stephen Tu 

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Posted 2015-September-13, 13:27

If you play K-S style weak NTs, you drop the response range of 1nt to 5-8 so this is an easy pass. 9+ bids 2d/2c.

Playing a 6-10 range as one might playing strong NTs is not ideal with weak NT as then this type of hand has the problem of missing game or playing 2nt opposite 6 counts.
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#5 User is offline   1eyedjack 

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Posted 2015-September-13, 13:28

Yeah, you hit upon one of the potential weaknesses of the weak 1N system.

Playing *strong* 1N you assume that a 1m opener is a weak 1N and respond 1N with about 5-10 points, expecting opener to pass. if opener shows game interest then he is either too strong to open a strong 1N or is distributional. All fairly safe.

You are to some extent resigned to a 1N response having a wider range than either a 1N opener or 1N rebid, even with a weak 1N system, and with that comes an inevitable consequence, that there will be occasions where 3N is in sight but 2N is at risk.

A flat 16 count is at the cusp where both risks are significant, but on balance I favour pass.
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#6 User is offline   rmnka447 

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Posted 2015-September-13, 14:40

Pass!

Yeah, you're probably playing 1 NT opposite the field, but that's an occupational hazard of playing weak NTs.

Playing a weak NT, a 1 NT call by responder should be 5-8. 2 NT should 9 to 10-. 3 NT 10+ to 15.

Since you're playing a weak NT, 1 m bids tend to be stronger. The only minimum hand opened 1 m is an unbalanced hand where opener intends to rebid 2 m. So you ought to adjust the NT response ranges to reflect this reality.

Since opener's hand looks to be headed toward no trump, opener might consider opening this hand 1 . This would let responder manufacture a 1 bid with certain hands and let opener rebid 1 NT with a strong NT hand to right side the contract.
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#7 User is offline   akwoo 

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Posted 2015-September-13, 15:34

I think the folks saying 1N should be 5 to 8 are exaggerating things a bit. I'm happy to play 1N as 6 to 9. Having 5 opposite 15 isn't that great a 1N contract.

I still pass. The perfect 9 count from partner is still only about 75% for 3N.
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#8 User is offline   BillPatch 

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Posted 2015-September-13, 17:58

View Postakwoo, on 2015-September-13, 15:34, said:

I think the folks saying 1N should be 5 to 8 are exaggerating things a bit. I'm happy to play 1N as 6 to 9. Having 5 opposite 15 isn't that great a 1N contract.

I still pass. The perfect 9 count from partner is still only about 75% for 3N.

Kaplan and Sheinwold were not exaggerating when they decreed that the range of the 1NT response to one of a minor is 5 to 8 points to avoid the problem posed by the OP in Kaplan-Seinwold.
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#9 User is offline   nige1 

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Posted 2015-September-13, 18:38

View Postmgoetze, on 2015-September-13, 12:24, said:

Is it mandatory to play extra-weak ACOL-style 2/1s when playing weak NT?
not mandatory but advisable. A similar problem occurs in 2/1 auctions which start 1b-1N (which can be mitigated to some extent by Gazilli).
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#10 User is offline   KurtGodel 

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Posted 2015-September-15, 03:43

It sort of depends what the range of 1NT is surely? If you are just playing Acol it seems pretty clear to pass, we have a bad 16, are we really holding out for a good 9? I would pass at teams too, unless you are going to tell me that this 1NT is a bit wider than normal.
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#11 User is offline   helene_t 

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Posted 2015-September-15, 06:07

Pass. No reason to upgrade this one. 2nt is 17-18.
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#12 User is offline   Tramticket 

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Posted 2015-September-15, 14:07

I might consider a 2NT bid vulnerable at IMPs, but otherwise an easy pass.
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#13 User is offline   Tramticket 

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Posted 2015-September-15, 14:11

I might consider a 2NT bid vulnerable at IMPs, but otherwise an easy pass.
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