[whereagles]

Jinsky, there are several styles for subsequent dbls for overcaller:

In style 1 dbl shows a max overcall and defensive hand. Something like what you had.

In style 2 dbl shows extras and take out shape. In this style, a 2nd dbl shows a hand that looks like style 1 but has take-outish shape. Say...

Qxx
AQJxx
Kx
AQx

If you have no agreements, 1st dbl is ok. But 2nd is very risky, as you never know what pard will make of it.

[cherdano]

Jinksy, on 2014-December-29, 03:33, said:

Agree about the second X. What do you object to about the first?

The first double is takeout. You don't have takeout shape.
Partner didn't act over 1H, you won't be missing game, and Qxx in their suit does not argue for competing.

[wank]

cherdano, on 2014-December-29, 04:59, said:

The first double is takeout. You don't have takeout shape.
Partner didn't act over 1H, you won't be missing game, and Qxx in their suit does not argue for competing.

what he said. yes you have a maximum, but your hand is very defensive. just defend and hope those extra values are sufficient to get 2D off. if partner has a hand too weak to act over 1h but shape suitable, which is what you're hoping for when you double, he can act himself in the passout seat.

you only need to act with extra values and a shape unsuitable hand when you're so strong you might make game opposite a hand from partner that's too weak to act himself. that seems rather unlikely when partner couldn't bid 1S/1NT or whatever over 1H.

[aguahombre]

cherdano, on 2014-December-29, 04:59, said:

The first double is takeout. You don't have takeout shape.
Partner didn't act over 1H, you won't be missing game, and Qxx in their suit does not argue for competing.

I don't understand. I have KX in Righty's suit, not QXX; I have 3-card support for the blacks and extra strength for my 1H overcall. How isn't that "takeout shape" on this auction? Partner would not have advanced over my 1H with 5 or six of a black suit and weakness.

The third-round double, however seems to be one of those "Didn't you see the auction, Partner?" restatements of the same thing I have already shown.

[billw55]

I also disagree with Jinksy's chosen bidding. But, IMO we should not let the weak hand off the hook either. I second gnasher's suggestion to call 2♠ over the first double, then 3♥ over the second.

Shared blame, next board.

[MrAce]

aguahombre, on 2014-December-29, 10:08, said:

I don't understand. I have KX in Righty's suit, not QXX; I have 3-card support for the blacks and extra strength for my 1H overcall. How isn't that "takeout shape" on this auction? Partner would not have advanced over my 1H with 5 or six of a black suit and weakness.

Jinksy, on 2014-December-28, 05:18, said:

I was the doubler, but I agree with everything mikeh said. I flipped on this hand, with:

Qxx
AQJxx
Qxx
AK


I did have the sense to apologise to P, but also felt mildly annoyed that she'd left it in. 3♦x made, of course.

[aguahombre]

If I didn't understand before, I certainly don't now.

[MrAce]

aguahombre, on 2014-December-29, 13:31, said:

If I didn't understand before, I certainly don't now.

There ain't no cure for a blind heart

But let me try again. Arend is talking about 1st dbl by Jinsky. And Jinsky said that he held Qxx AQJxx Qxx AK. Idk which Kx in their suit and 3 card support for all other black suits you are mentioning, obviously not the one we are discussing in this topic.

[aguahombre]

MrAce, on 2014-December-29, 13:33, said:

There ain't no cure for a blind heart

But let me try again. Arend is talking about 1st dbl by Jinsky. And Jinsky said that he held Qxx AQJxx Qxx AK. Idk which Kx in their suit and 3 card support for all other black suits you are mentioning, obviously not the one we are discussing in this topic.

Yeh, I got Whereagles' example mixed in there, somehow...and before you fixed your post, it came out as just a bunch of computer stuff.