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What is the range of 1H-1N-2N? Any difference for 1S-1N-2N

Poll: What is the range of 1H-1N-2N? (19 member(s) have cast votes)

What is the range of 1H-1N-2N?

  1. good 15 to bad 18, 4-5-3-1 or 4-5-2-2, shor minors (4 votes [21.05%])

    Percentage of vote: 21.05%

  2. 18-19, the same range as 1m-1y-2N (14 votes [73.68%])

    Percentage of vote: 73.68%

  3. other (please specify) (1 votes [5.26%])

    Percentage of vote: 5.26%

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#1 User is offline   HeartA 

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Posted 2005-February-28, 01:43

On today's Regional, there was disagreement between my pd and me. Assuming no interference, what is the range of 1♥-1N-2N? And what about 1♠-1N-2N?
Senshu
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#2 User is offline   helene_t 

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Posted 2005-February-28, 02:38

1♠-1NT-2NT should give responder the possibility to bid a 5-card hearts (forcing) safely, so it should be 18-19. It makes sense to play 1♥-1NT-2NT as slightly weaker, if you're one of those who don't open 1NT with a 5-card major.

You can also play 1♠-1NT-3♣ as an artificial gameforce. In that case, 2NT becomes a limit raise.
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#3 User is offline   Gerben47 

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Posted 2005-February-28, 03:07

It shows the range of "I want to play 3NT if you have more than a minimum 1NT response". If you want a number I'll say 17-18.
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#4 User is offline   bearmum 

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Posted 2005-February-28, 04:23

HeartA, on Feb 28 2005, 08:43 PM, said:

On today's Regional, there was disagreement between my pd and me.  Assuming no interference, what is the range of 1♥-1N-2N?  And what about 1♠-1N-2N?

ASSUMING you don't open 1NT with a 5 card M BOTH bids show 15-18 with a weakish 5 C major (INHO :D )
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#5 User is offline   joker_gib 

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Posted 2005-February-28, 06:08

Gerben47, on Feb 28 2005, 04:07 AM, said:

It shows the range of "I want to play 3NT if you have more than a minimum 1NT response".

Crystal clear ! :rolleyes:
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#6 User is offline   mcphee 

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Posted 2005-February-28, 06:32

If playing 2/1 the range is supposed to show 18-19 balanced or possibly semi balance (5-4-2-2). A hand which holds a running 5 card major should be upgraded if 17 is the definition I would use.
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#7 User is offline   flytoox 

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Posted 2005-February-28, 06:39

I think good 17 to bad 19.
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#8 User is offline   pbleighton 

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Posted 2005-February-28, 06:40

I play 15+-18-, but many play 18-19.

"25 Steps To Learning 2/1", by Paul Thurston, says 18-19. Bergen's "Understadnding 1NT Forcing" says 17-18, 5332, but he advocates counting length for hcp in 1NT and 2NT openings, so this is equivalent. This OKBridge-related site says 18-19:

http://www.annam.co.uk/2-1.html

Perhaps someone knows. Did this used to be the standard treatment?

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#9 User is offline   Fluffy 

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Posted 2005-February-28, 09:35

Game forcing, not necesarilly balanced.
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#10 User is offline   HeartA 

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Posted 2005-February-28, 12:13

Then how would you rebid with a hand ♠KJxx, ♥KQxxx, ♦Ax, ♣Kx? or ♠KQx, ♥Qxxxxx, ♦Ax, ♣KQ?
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#11 User is offline   Flame 

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Posted 2005-February-28, 12:28

HeartA, on Feb 28 2005, 01:13 PM, said:

Then how would you rebid with a hand ♠KJxx, ♥KQxxx, ♦Ax, ♣Kx? or ♠KQx, ♥Qxxxxx, ♦Ax, ♣KQ?

The first is a normal 2sp, the second is less clear i would bid 3H.
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#12 User is offline   flytoox 

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Posted 2005-February-28, 12:53

Flame, on Feb 28 2005, 06:28 PM, said:

HeartA, on Feb 28 2005, 01:13 PM, said:

Then how would you rebid with a hand ♠KJxx, ♥KQxxx, ♦Ax, ♣Kx? or ♠KQx, ♥Qxxxxx, ♦Ax, ♣KQ?

The first is a normal 2sp, the second is less clear i would bid 3H.

3H is far too a stretch with 2nd hand. I think I would rebid 2H.
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#13 User is offline   fred 

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Posted 2005-February-28, 12:55

HeartA, on Feb 28 2005, 06:13 PM, said:

Then how would you rebid with a hand ♠KJxx, ♥KQxxx, ♦Ax, ♣Kx? or ♠KQx, ♥Qxxxxx, ♦Ax, ♣KQ?

With my regular partner I would seriously considering opening 1NT with both of these hands.

For me (and, as far as I can tell, for most American experts who play 2/1), the 2NT rebid suggests a good 17 to 19 HCP.

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#14 Guest_Jlall_*

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Posted 2005-February-28, 13:03

i always open 1N when in range but as far as i know if you open 1M 15-17 youre supposed to bid 2 of a minor and then 2N (or pass with 15 over the preference). I think this shows 18-19 (or an upgraded 17).
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#15 User is offline   jdulmage 

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Posted 2005-February-28, 13:29

16-17 points, balanced. So you are probably looking at 5-3-3-2 or something.
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#16 User is offline   HeartA 

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Posted 2005-February-28, 14:36

fred, on Feb 28 2005, 01:55 PM, said:

HeartA, on Feb 28 2005, 06:13 PM, said:

Then how would you rebid with a hand ♠KJxx, ♥KQxxx, ♦Ax, ♣Kx? or ♠KQx, ♥Qxxxxx, ♦Ax, ♣KQ?

With my regular partner I would seriously considering opening 1NT with both of these hands.

For me (and, as far as I can tell, for most American experts who play 2/1), the 2NT rebid suggests a good 17 to 19 HCP.

Fred Gitelman
Bridge Base Inc.
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Thanks for your reply, Fred. Then what would you rebid if you hold 16 hcp and 4-5-1-3 (short minors)?
Senshu
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#17 User is offline   fred 

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Posted 2005-February-28, 14:48

HeartA, on Feb 28 2005, 08:36 PM, said:

fred, on Feb 28 2005, 01:55 PM, said:

HeartA, on Feb 28 2005, 06:13 PM, said:

Then how would you rebid with a hand ♠KJxx, ♥KQxxx, ♦Ax, ♣Kx? or ♠KQx, ♥Qxxxxx, ♦Ax, ♣KQ?

With my regular partner I would seriously considering opening 1NT with both of these hands.

For me (and, as far as I can tell, for most American experts who play 2/1), the 2NT rebid suggests a good 17 to 19 HCP.

Fred Gitelman
Bridge Base Inc.
www.bridgebase.com

Thanks for your reply, Fred. Then what would you rebid if you hold 16 hcp and 4-5-1-3 (short minors)?

Usually 2 of my 3-card minor, but I might bid 2S if my strength was concentrated in the majors (AKJx AKJxx xxx x for example).

Fred Gitelman
Bridge Base Inc.
www.bridgebase.com
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#18 User is offline   HeartA 

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Posted 2005-March-01, 13:43

Thanks, Fred
Senshu
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