[baraka]

They never gave me the big fat book on GIB's phylosophy of bidding. So, I guess that a lot of us have to fly blind oftentimes, but this one I just dont get. GIB should have passed fast and furious after the XX. That would have shut me up ! Does anyone know if GIB has a random function running in the background telling him when to make a bad bid even though he knows it's a bad bid ?

---

[gszes]

it is normal to "ignore" the xx and make the bid you would have
made w/o the xx. The robot did the "normal" thing. This hand
requires some judgement (not a robot strong point). With essentially
equal support for all the unbid suits --most especially with 44 in
the majors and a complete crud hand the hand should pass. It is sort
of easy to program a robot to take this type of hand into consideration
but only if the programmer thought of it when doing the AI.

[baraka]

gszes, on 2014-June-30, 11:01, said:

it is normal to "ignore" the xx and make the bid you would have
made w/o the xx. The robot did the "normal" thing. This hand
requires some judgement (not a robot strong point). With essentially
equal support for all the unbid suits --most especially with 44 in
the majors and a complete crud hand the hand should pass. It is sort
of easy to program a robot to take this type of hand into consideration
but only if the programmer thought of it when doing the AI.

Sorry, but it is not normal to ignore the XX. If West passes, North has the duty to bid unless he has a penalty. On west's bid, north is releived of it's duty to bid and should pass to send the message that the hand does not belong to us. It looks to me as an essencial message. Those who ignore the XX have a bidding problem ! Period !

[Bbradley62]

baraka, on 2014-June-30, 11:46, said:

Sorry, but it is not normal to ignore the XX. If West passes, North has the duty to bid unless he has a penalty. On west's bid, north is releived of it's duty to bid and should pass to send the message that the hand does not belong to us. It looks to me as an essencial message. Those who ignore the XX have a bidding problem ! Period !

Wrong. Despite your pompous attitude. After two players show opening hands and a third shows 10+HCP, how much can possibly be left for the fourth hand? Virtually never enough to want to defend 1♦XX. And on this hand, you're looking at 19HCP when opps have shown 21+HCP. (GIB never opens at 1 level without 11HCP.) On this particular hand, as gzses points out, GIB might pass to show indifference between the unbid suits. But certainly with xx, xxxxx, xxx, xxx GIB would be expected to bid 1♥ to get out of the redouble situation.

[the hog]

baraka, on 2014-June-30, 11:46, said:

Sorry, but it is not normal to ignore the XX. If West passes, North has the duty to bid unless he has a penalty. On west's bid, north is releived of it's duty to bid and should pass to send the message that the hand does not belong to us. It looks to me as an essencial message. Those who ignore the XX have a bidding problem ! Period !

Yes it is normal. I would expect any bridge player to bid 1H on the north hand. It looks to me the only one who had a "bidding problem"was the 2C bidder. What an appalling bid. 2H is just as bad. Lucky you were not doubled. Perhaps you should do some reading on competitive auctions.

[Stephen Tu]

Passing doesn't send the message that "the hand doesn't belong to us". In fact, passing first, then bidding freely later, is actually the standard advanced technique to *expose* a psyche by the opponents, that the hand does in fact likely belong to us.

The normal priority after a redouble is to try to scramble to a playable spot as low as possible, to minimize the penalty if one is due, or hope the opponents bid on and take us off the hook. Normally 1♥ would show a preference for hearts over spades, to cater to responder having say a weak hand with 5+ hearts, and the doubler having doubled with say 4-3-2-4 shape. Actually *pass* I believe is completely normal with the North hand, then such a doubler can bid 1♠ since advancer didn't express a preference, and you have found your 4-4 fit at the 1 level. Bidding vs. not bidding is about expressing preference for a trump suit, NOT an expression of high card strength; bidding 1♥ lets you play there when you want when passing would provoke partner to bid 1♠. Arguably after the redouble, if opener hadn't rebid, South should bid 1♠, it's not unlikely to catch a fit and is less likely to be axed holding the AKQ.

1♥ didn't show any strength, so it was foolhardy to come back in with 2♣ when RHO had already taken you off the hook with 1♠. 1♥ doesn't show any better than a 3433 yarb.

[1eyedjack]

I don't think that 1S is an unreasonable bid over the redouble.

In terms of hitting your best fit immediately it is just as likely to be right as 1H.

If opener had been planning to bid the other major I am only very marginally inconvenienced by his bidding 2H over 1S contrasted with 1S over 1H, and I am not right bothered either way, having primary support for both.

Bidding 1S could have the edge if the auction develops in such a way that I feel compelled to bid again. At least there is very little downside.

[johnu]

gszes, on 2014-June-30, 11:01, said:

it is normal to "ignore" the xx and make the bid you would have
made w/o the xx. The robot did the "normal" thing. This hand
requires some judgement (not a robot strong point). With essentially
equal support for all the unbid suits --most especially with 44 in
the majors and a complete crud hand the hand should pass. It is sort
of easy to program a robot to take this type of hand into consideration
but only if the programmer thought of it when doing the AI.

Exactly right. You have no strong preference for any suit. If you bid a major and partner has a rock crusher, you risk playing in a 4-3 fit when there is a 4-4 fit in the other major. If partner has 5+ clubs and 3-3 or less in the majors, you'll be ok in clubs.

[ahydra]

At this vul, 2C is close. South has a good hand and we don't want the opps to steal the contract in 1NT, which is what probably happens if South passes. Give North 10xxx in clubs and out and 2C is even favourite to make (plus allows North to compete to 3C over 2M in some cases).

Here the problem is the suit quality isn't great so if one of the opps happens to be stacked in clubs, as here, you run into trouble. If it was KJ10xx (say with SJ instead of SQ) I think it would be clear.

2H, on the other hand... definitely not everyone's choice, to say the least.

ahydra