[hermas]

We play 2/1, NV vs NV. I hold KXX AQXX - JT9XXX seated at south.
Partner opened 1h and RHO overcalled 2d.
This is the auction.

W N E S
1H 2D 3D*
P 3S* P 4D*
P 4NT* P 5C*
P 5D* P 5S*
P 6H AP

3D = H fit, limit raise+
3S/4D = Cuebid
4N = RKC, 5C = 1/4
5D = inquery for q
5S = HQ + SK

After 3S, we bid 3nt as serious slam interest.
Partner holds AXX KJXXX QJ9 AK. Would you please give me some comments about the auction,
and which is your suggesting auction. Thanks again.

[Cyberyeti]

What is 1♥-(2♦)-4♦ for you ? (or indeed 4♣ ?)

[akwoo]

Over 4N, you can bid 6D, which shows an odd number of key cards plus a diamond void. (In general, standard seems to be that 5N shows two with an unspecified void, a jump to 6x where x is below trump shows an odd number with a void in x, and a jump to 6 of trump shows an odd number with a higher void. But please discuss this with partner before springing it on him or her! And of course you don't bid 6 with one and a void if you think partner needs more than that to make a small slam.)

Depending on your requirements for a limit raise (and there is a reasonable argument that your hand is worth one even without the heart Q), partner might be able to guess to bid the grand at that point, especially if playing MPs in a strong field where 52% grand slams are at worst slightly against the odds.

[hermas]

 Cyberyeti, on 2013-December-29, 22:33, said:

What is 1♥-(2♦)-4♦ for you ? (or indeed 4♣ ?)

4D = splinter

[aguahombre]

In order to bid a suit grand, we must have the ability to know we have all the first-round controls, no trump losers.. and then the vision of taking 13 tricks.

Responder would have bid the same way with Kxx QXXX AX QXXX or with KXX AQXX KX JXXX.

Showing a useful void in response to RKC might have succeeded, but discussion about follow-ups after that jump bid showing one Key and the void would still be necessary.

Starting with a Splinter 4D Response seems obvious, rather than a non-descript 3D Lr+ bid. But, it would lead to the same problem if you don't show all the controls.

[lycier]

4NT---6♦,6♦ shows 1 or 3 keycard with void in ♦,if doing so,your partner will be easier for making decision of 7♥

[Antrax]

You may want to embed this in the first post, replacing some of the content:

---

[Lorne50]

I think your problem is that 4♦ showed a high card control in diamonds because with a small singleton or void you would have bid 4♦ over 2♦ earlier in the auction. Hence your partner knew you were missing an ace but had no way to know it did not matter.

[steve2005]

this is more difficult than just saying start with 4♦. u need partner to have AK♣ for this to be a good grand
or partner needs you to have 6♣ to throw ♠ loser
I don't see how one partner can show this to other if u start with 4♦

[mike777]

tough to get to 7h you will need some well practiced agreements to show D void.....HQ and Club K and KS.

Not sure pard will know to bid 7h after showing one keycard and d void with 6d.wont know about HQ.

[Cyberyeti]

 steve2005, on 2013-December-30, 19:11, said:

this is more difficult than just saying start with 4♦. u need partner to have AK♣ for this to be a good grand
or partner needs you to have 6♣ to throw ♠ loser
I don't see how one partner can show this to other if u start with 4♦

Only needs 6 clubs if the clubs are bad, Kxxx, AQxx, void Qxxxx seems to be pretty good.

We are helped by 4♦ being specifically a void for us.

1♥-(2♦)-4♦
4♠(KC)-5♣(1/4)
5♦(Q♥?)-5♠(yes + K♠)
6♣-7♥

The worst this can be on is AKx/J109xxx to come in, and if partner has 2 or 4 clubs it's a lot better than that.

[Zelandakh]

1♥ - (2♦) - 4♦ seems like the obvious start and next an immediate Kickback/RKCB is surely going to be the popular choice. How many have adapted their void-showing responses in this situation? Assuming 4♠ is the ask and therefore 5♠ shows a ♦ void and even number, we have lots of ways of showing a diamond void with an odd number. It seems obvious to use the first step (5NT) to deny the trump queen and further steps to show her plus side kings. So now 6♦ = ♦ void + odd # key cards + ♥Q + ♠K. Is that enough? We cannot count 13 but the odds seem to be with us with many possibilities for that last trick. In summary:-

1♥ - (2♦) - 4♦;
4♠ - 6♦;
7♥

So I do not see the lack of CY's void splinter agreement as a major impediment here.

[mike777]

I do


7h just hard to get too

[P_Marlowe]

 Lorne50, on 2013-December-30, 06:24, said:

I think your problem is that 4♦ showed a high card control in diamonds because with a small singleton or void you would have bid 4♦ over 2♦ earlier in the auction. Hence your partner knew you were missing an ace but had no way to know it did not matter.

I think in the given seq. 4D should show a shortage.
The difference between 3D / 4D and a direct 4D bid being, that the given route sets up a
forcing sequence, while a direct 4D bid does not.

[humilities]

First of all - your partner is completely absolved as in my mind you never conclusively showed a ♦ void. From his perspective you could be off a cashing Ace.

Our style:
4♦ at that level (below game in our suit) shows a ♦ *control* not necessarily first round control. You would want to make the same bid with KQx AQx x J10xxxx else partner will always think you are off 2 cashing ♦ tricks. RKC will then sort out the aces/voids.

Given that, you absolutely *must* show the void when partner bids 4NT else he will think you are off a cashing Ace. Then, partner may or may not get it right, but at least he has a chance. As the above posters have said, it's hard for either side to be sure the clubs will provide 13 tricks...

Splinters sort of solve this, sort of not, as you could easily have a similar hand with 3 trumps:
KQx AQx - J10xxxxx
or
KQx AQx x J10xxxx
or
KQx AQx xx J10xxx

None of the above really qualify for a splinter. With the first two, though, you need to cue 4♦, with the third your lack of cue is just as critical.

[phoenix214]

The bidding can continue 1♥-(2♦), 4♣, which should be with natural with heart support. This can make a better picture of your hand. The problem now is if partner has a good hand. He will usually bid 4H(4D if last train), or bid 4D with a diamond control. Now, if he denies a diamond control, things start to get a little bit interesting. You can count 11+10+13=34 points, =>34/3=11 tricks(3 suit balance). That means your hand is worth one more bid if he is nt a total bust with the diamond queen. Now lets say, you bid 4S, which is a spade control. Partner now should like his hand with the move you made, so his is worth a 5C bid. I suppose, now if you bid 5D, partner bids 5S, and you bid 6D, he should know what is happening.

The 4♠ bid should imply a diamond value as well, because without one, you should not expect to make slam.

---

After the 6 diamond bid, its up to W to evaluate his hand. With the way E bid his hand, he can suspect a 6 card club suit. (With a 4-4-0-5 and a bad suit he would start 4D). This leaves him with 6 clubs. If he has a singleton spade. Then he is something like x-AQx-AKx-xxxxxx, (The 6D bid should show a well controled diamond suit, void or AK). 1-3-4-5 shape, is not real. Else he hase Kxx-AQx-A-xxxxxx, or Kxx-AQxx- -xxxxxx. With the last hand we can make 7. With the other we have good chances as well, with good breaks, although with the first of the last two hands he would not bid 6D(I think).
With your action, i do not like W bidding, due to the fact, i like opening 1NT with 5332 hands, and blackwood is not my favorite convetion(I think the blackwood is bad with his hand anyway). With his hand, all he needs from you is a spade control(King/Singleton) and 4 hearts with one Ace. If he bids 5 clubs, and you bid 5 diamonds. Then with 5NT(Grand slam try), he might hit the grand again, knowing that you need to have some values for your bidding.