[mikeh]

humilities, on 2013-December-02, 14:07, said:

Thank you all for the constructive responses.



Mike, as South, it's gratifying to hear you say that, but I fear you overestimate B/I/A. I presented it this way for a reason - we played this hand on BBO and exactly zero Norths bid 4S. BUT, six pairs got to 4S when South raised 3 to 4. So what seems obvious wasn't so to my partner with all of BBO on his side then again maybe that should have told him something...

I think that a very large part of the bridge playing community, at the less-than-advanced stage, have very little understanding of takeout doubles and/or the subsequent actions.

Thus at the club level, I have seen the doubler rebid 1N with a balanced 13 count, having doubled simply because they had an opening hand.

I have seen advancer make a non jump response with 11 or 12 hcp, had doubler, with 13 raise and then they bid game. Since by doing so they reach the normal spot, they think they got there the normal way and life goes on.

So I am not the least surprised to learn that in real life, or the facsimile thereof that is BBO, myriads of bad players would double and bid again, without ken's feared slow 3♠.

I guess what I was trying to say, and maybe I am overestimating the B/I/A threads here on the forum, was that the vast majority of posters, even if they self-rate as I or A, know that S had no bid over 3♠. Those B/I/A players with the interest in the game that caused them to find and read these forums are not going to bid like those club/BBO people, at least not for long

[wank]

Clear 4h bid for north. 2 places to play. Spade suit is too bad for 4s. Yes game might not make - you've gone off before, right? Trying to stop on a dime in 3s is playing scared.

[Fluffy]

mikeh, on 2013-December-02, 10:44, said:

Put another way, is there a real bridge player alive who sees this hand as having significantly more playing strength than Kxxx xx 10xx AQxx, a 9 count?

Is there any player who thinks any lonely jack has significant strenght?

mikeh, on 2013-December-02, 10:44, said:

Thus at the club level, I have seen the doubler rebid 1N with a balanced 13 count, having doubled simply because they had an opening hand.<br style="color: rgb(28, 40, 55); font-size: 13px; line-height: 19px; background-color: rgb(248, 248, 248);"><br style="color: rgb(28, 40, 55); font-size: 13px; line-height: 19px; background-color: rgb(248, 248, 248);">I have seen advancer make a non jump response with 11 or 12 hcp, had doubler, with 13 raise and then they bid game. Since by doing so they reach the normal spot, they think they got there the normal way and life goes on.<br style="color: rgb(28, 40, 55); font-size: 13px; line-height: 19px; background-color: rgb(248, 248, 248);"><br style="color: rgb(28, 40, 55); font-size: 13px; line-height: 19px; background-color: rgb(248, 248, 248);">So I am not the least surprised to learn that in real life, or the facsimile thereof that is BBO, myriads of bad players would double and bid again, without ken's feared slow 3♠.<br style="color: rgb(28, 40, 55); font-size: 13px; line-height: 19px; background-color: rgb(248, 248, 248);">

The best pair at the club bid: double-2NT-3NT over a weak 2 major opening, they had 12 vs 12. I started to suspect they might be having signals or something after that hand, but now I think they are just that bad.

[Zelandakh]

Fluffy, on 2013-December-02, 17:09, said:

The best pair at the club bid:

Surely the best pair at the club is you + some partner, Fluffy?

[the hog]

I would bid 4S with the Nth hand. South cannot bid again over 3S.

[mike777]

north 75%...rub of the green 25%

imps...vul....bid game then try and make it.

When I read the wC book each year..I see they bid game on any and all excuses.


Granted they play the hands wonderful.

[rmnka447]

I'm bidding 4 ♠, but would be a little uncomfortable until I saw dummy.

As someone said, 3 ♠ could be bid on zilch. So unless partner has a huge hand, it is unlikely that a raise will be made.

The only time I might consider bidding 3 ♠ is if partner is notorious for doubling very lightly against preempts.

[CSGibson]

I see this in a similar light to what I would do with a 3 card limit raise in the auction 1H-(2S)...in preempted auctions, limit raises with no room to differentiate generally just bid game. That being said, I think the N hand is borderline, but I still think it is generally worth a shot.

[quiddity]

CSGibson, on 2013-December-06, 18:04, said:

I see this in a similar light to what I would do with a 3 card limit raise in the auction 1H-(2S)...in preempted auctions, limit raises with no room to differentiate generally just bid game. That being said, I think the N hand is borderline, but I still think it is generally worth a shot.

I like the analogy. I would bid game with a limit raise and at least an 8-card fit. Here I have a limit raise and at most an 8-card fit. And after the 3♥ bid and partner's double my limit raise looks a lot like a balanced 9-count.