[scoob]

didier17, on Jan 13 2005, 02:43 AM, said:

For 2005,
a linux version for BBO ... great

[inquiry]

scoob, on Jan 14 2005, 10:07 AM, said:

didier17, on Jan 13 2005, 02:43 AM, said:

For 2005,
a linux version for BBO ... great

This linux question thing pops up every now and then. Uday actually addressed it once, where he said, among others, that developing a version for linux wasn't an issue for them due to the relative size of the userbases (this would be windows users worldwide versus linux users worldwide).

He did say he was going to see if he could improve (or at least investigate) how well netbridgevu ran under windows simulators in linux.

But other users (including now you guys) have already been doing this....I refer you to the following threads...

Version 3.9.8 & Linux Cedega
BBO for Linux
BBO/Linux?

From my perspective, it is great that BBO can run under a simulator in linux. But I get the feeling a number of the linux posters want a native linux version of netbridgevu. Of course, I can't speak for Fred or uday, but I sure hope their answer would be "You got to be kidding". The reason is with two programmers working on BBO gaming software (and BBO server) I don't want them splitting their time between trying to maintain and support two different source codes. That is a selfish "ben" reason.. I like the rate of improvement and new features we get, and the attention to bugs. A second reason is the way the program works. While Microsoft took a lot of grief over the "embedded browser" issue thing, the ability to use these embedded tools has no doubt saved uday and fred thousands of hours of programming time. The linux community works by sharing the source code and having thousands of people (or hundreds) work on improving it for free. Here Fred and Uday have a commercial product, and might well have security concerns if source code was out over password issues, money issues and BB$ accounts, not to mention their own intellectual property issues. I can't imagine them wanting to turn over the BBO code so that any competitor (or unhappy player who gets booted for cursing like a druken sailor) can start up competiting sites overnight using his own source code.

There are probalby a lot of other reasons for not native linux code.. the biggest is the userbase number and the effectiveness of the existig simulators for the small number of linux enthusast who play bridge on line. I think the solution is for BBO members who use linux to continue sharing their success (and failure) stories on what linux installations work with BBO and what problems exist.

Ben

[fred]

Ben's answer is right on. Given the current state of our company and the number of Linux users out there at this point in time, it would be a ridiculous business decision to create a native Linux version. Sure that could change, but I am betting against it happening in the next couple of years.

Fred Gitelman
Bridge Base Inc.
www.bridgebase.com

[guggie]

A button that would get red when a TD is called, saves the TD irritating pop ups, and saves the table typing TD called (what nobody ever does, except me), and saves remarks like: one call per table suffices.

OK it is a luxury gadget

[david_c]

What I would really like to see is a change to the way lists are displayed in BBO (i.e. the list of tables, list of people in the lobby etc.). At the moment all the names are continually moving around as they are updated, which makes it very hard to keep track the one you're interested in. Particularly annoying is when you're hovering over one name and want to move to a different one - by starting to move you sometimes cause everything to change round, so that the place you're heading for is different.

If this has been discussed before then sorry for bringing it up again. But here is what I think would be an improvement:

At the moment, if your mouse is over a name in a list, then that name stays still. Why not go further, so that when your mouse is anywhere on the list, the entire list stays still? If a name were to disappear from the ones being displayed, it would be replaced by a blank space. This way, if you want to allow the list to update, you keep the mouse away from it, but if you want to keep the list still while you have a good look, you move the mouse onto it.

[hotShot]

TD calls collected in list displayed in a separated window looking like this:

Round 2, Table 7, Called by trippleXXX, Message: Have a problem....

that would be a great

[hrothgar]

inquiry, on Jan 14 2005, 05:54 PM, said:

This linux question thing pops up every now and then. Uday actually addressed it once, where he said, among others, that developing a version for linux wasn't an issue for them due to the relative size of the userbases (this would be windows users worldwide versus linux users worldwide).

From my perspective, the debate over Linux is being framed the wrong way. I'm a big fan of Linux and use it extensively in my daily life. However, much as I would love to see the a Linux client for BBO, I think that it would be a very poor investment of resources on the part of BBO's management team. Plain and simple, the Linux user base isn't dense enough to justify the development resources that would be required.

Equally significant, Open Source development philosophy is very much based on the concept that if you have an itch, you should be the one to scratch it... I strongly suspect that if a Linux client for BBO is ever going to be developed, it will need to be developed by group of programmers separate and distinct from BBO, operating as a traditional Open Source development project.

Those individuals advocating a Linux client should NOT be pushing for Fred and Uday to write them a client for Linux, but rather that BBO establish a well-defined and open interface between the client and the server. This type of interface would be an necessary prerequisite for any successful private client development project.

Fred has pointed out in the past that defining a standard interface would also require a substantial investment of resources, while simultaneously limiting his flexibility in improving the product. For example, BBO was experiencing some significant congestion problems. Fred and Uday were able to quickly push out a patch that modified the way in which "Lobby information" was transmitted between the client and the server. If BBO were forced to follow a standardized interface, these types of redesigns would become much more difficult.

In short, its unclear to me whether Fred would (or should) be willing create an open interface. However, if you really want to see a Linux client, this is probably the best way to do so.

[hotShot]

A clean way of doing this would be to develop the client in Java or to target a .NET environment that might be available for Linux too.

[inquiry]

hotShot, on Jan 14 2005, 02:57 PM, said:

A clean way of doing this would be to develop the client in Java or to target a  .NET environment that might be available for Linux too.

Java.. ARGHHHHHHHHHHHHHH... can you imagine a java-based bridge environments.. slow and painful. Dummied down to lowest common java-compatible device. No wait.. you don't ahve to imagine, go suffer with J-bridge... or help them improve.... but there is your model.

[hrothgar]

hotShot, on Jan 14 2005, 09:57 PM, said:

A clean way of doing this would be to develop the client in Java or to target a .NET environment that might be available for Linux too.

Write once, compile many???

Shudder. I recall the OKB Java experiments.

[hotShot]

inquiry, on Jan 14 2005, 07:22 PM, said:

Java.. ARGHHHHHHHHHHHHHH... can you imagine a java-based bridge environments.. slow and painful. Dummied down to lowest common java-compatible device. No wait.. you don't ahve to imagine, go suffer with J-bridge... or help them improve.... but there is your model.

Well I will not start a discussion about Java prejudice here, but this is often a question of the programmers abilities.

I just tried J-Bridge, but since I was the only player online I will not make my mind up now.

[Deanrover]

If you want to play online bridge on Java, I recommend Bridge Club Live. I guarantee you will be back on BBO within 12 hours.

[keylime]

Java? FOR THE LOVE OF WATCHING FANTONI MAKE SLAMS LOOK RIDICULOUSLY EASY, NO JAVA EXCEPT FOR COFFEE!!!!!!!!!!!!!

<by the way, Fantoni is like my new idol - he inspires me to do great things>

[Hemi_rr]

ciscokid, on Jan 6 2005, 08:35 PM, said:

Here are some of my 2005 wish list for BBO enhancements/improvements. Many have already been suggested and I'm simply adding my voice to those.

-CK

When you are invited to a team game, having the ability to tell (by color) whether your opps, partner or teammates are your friends, or enimies

Ability to bring up a saved pre-alert (ie: Greetings opps, we play 2/1, ud/ca, multi) instead of having to type it each time. More beneficial when playing in tournaments.

Dramatic overhaul of the Teams invite system

The ability to click on user's name and going to their table

The ability to cut and paste BBO chat

The ability to send a private message to multiple people at the same time

Ability to bring up a saved alert to a bid

Swiss team tournaments

Ability to include defenses to conventions on the convention card for conventions that are not famialir to many players (ie: Multi)

"Ability to bring up a saved pre-alert (ie: Greetings opps, we play 2/1, ud/ca, multi) instead of having to type it each time. More beneficial when playing in tournaments."

I do this now by adding custom text to partner (right click and type in box)
Once the text is entered click ok

I have text summarizing basic approach for each of my tourney partners
To retrieve text, right click on name Highlight text and "Ctrl C"
click cancel; then in chat dialogue "Ctrl V" to insert text
eg "Hi GL ops - 2/1 UDCA O/E - cc posted"

Each new table click chat then "Ctrl V"

For casual play/ pick up partners I also type in what agreements we have (also useful for future sessions) Sometime I can't remember all details dicussed when I sat down so instead of scrolling back through tons of chat to see if drury or rev drury I right click on name to refresh memory.
Also makes it easy to use to create a CC if needed for tourney

Each time we have a new ops sit I can the paste to chat dialogue.
Eg. "We are playing pard's profile - 2/1 with stollen bid, std carding and O/E Western Cue bid"

[arrows]

like some others, I think the things about organizing a team game
need to be improved......

Personally, I guess starting the thing by creating a chat room might be a good idea:

1. the software already has a module of chat room. add a pop-up(just like in
Vugraph), showing the status of the 8 slots. the organizer has the right to assign
seat upon request, or allow/disallow more people get into this room....

2. Give people a chance to social around....

3. People have a chance to discuss who are going to play with who....

4. The organizer doesn't have to yell in the lobby any more, which, at least
save some bandwidth.......

[hrothgar]

Hemi_rr, on Jan 16 2005, 10:36 PM, said:

Ability to bring up a saved pre-alert (ie: Greetings opps, we play 2/1, ud/ca, multi) instead of having to type it each time. More beneficial when playing in tournaments.

As any long time member of this forum knows, I'm strongly in favor of improving the BBO's convention card utility. With this said and done, I'm not sure whether it would really be useful to enable relatively minor changes like the ones that you are describing.

Currently, there are a number of third party applications available on the market that can be used to easily generate text strings for alerts. I'm partial to "Remote Keys", which can be freely downloaded fro http://www.freewareh.../RemoteKeys.htm I have a fairly complete set of scripts available for the systems that I normally play. I've found this MUCH easier than the cut and paste options. From my perspective, embedding this functionality within the BBO application itself really wouldn't add all that much value. It would, however, require Fred and Uday to expend development resources to support this functionality. I think that it would be MUCH easier to simply point people towards the application... (Please note, I am still VERY much in favor of a more comprehensive revision to the CC system, but thats another story)

[andych]

In the BBO options we can set the color. But the colour are only plain colour except use felt. Could add some more 'felt' colour for choice?