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Fit or not ?

#21 User is offline   han 

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Posted 2012-August-24, 08:28

In the finals yesterday east had Axxx Kxxxxxx x x in first seat. Should you open something with this hand? I would hate to do so, but if I couldn't bid my hearts naturally later, I might have to.
Please note: I am interested in boring, bog standard, 2/1.

- hrothgar
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#22 User is offline   the_clown 

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Posted 2012-August-24, 08:42

View Posthan, on 2012-August-24, 08:28, said:

In the finals yesterday east had Axxx Kxxxxxx x x in first seat. Should you open something with this hand? I would hate to do so, but if I couldn't bid my hearts naturally later, I might have to.


I also hate opening this hand. I play these as fit-showing only when partner opened/overcalled a major. When he has bid a minor I think we all agree is better to be able to introduce our own suit.

If you had x x Kxxxxxx Axxx, and the bidding went p-p-(1-2-(2) I am sure you will want to make a 3 bid. Partner will never know what to do holding a singleton and a 6th , assuming that you make the same bid with 6 average and Hx in .

Apart from that I would have opened 3 on the hand anyway unless unfav.
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#23 User is offline   han 

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Posted 2012-August-24, 08:49

OK, nicely done making both suits minors. But what if you held Axxx x Kxxxxxx x in first seat, would you open that? If not and if it goes

p - 1C - 1H - 3C
??

can you then bid your diamonds?
Please note: I am interested in boring, bog standard, 2/1.

- hrothgar
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#24 User is offline   bluecalm 

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Posted 2012-August-24, 08:55

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Try this. Transfers in both auctions.


How I wish one day be a part of a partnership willing to endure system which such detailed agreements.
I like it though, very nice.
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#25 User is offline   han 

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Posted 2012-August-24, 09:03

View Postbluecalm, on 2012-August-24, 08:55, said:

How I wish one day be a part of a partnership willing to endure system which such detailed agreements.
I like it though, very nice.


It may be nice but is it also good? One reason to play these fitbids is so that partner can make a good decision if there is more competition. But how can partner make a good decision if you can have a fit bid, a lead director, or just your own suit? It seems to me that you are often worse off than playing fit bids or playing naturally.

This is a major problem with playing 2-way bids or wide ranging transfers in competition. It sounds nice because you have a bid for everything, but if there is more bidding than partner doesn't know what you have.
Please note: I am interested in boring, bog standard, 2/1.

- hrothgar
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#26 User is offline   the_clown 

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Posted 2012-August-24, 10:02

View Posthan, on 2012-August-24, 08:49, said:

OK, nicely done making both suits minors. But what if you held Axxx x Kxxxxxx x in first seat, would you open that? If not and if it goes

p - 1C - 1H - 3C
??

can you then bid your diamonds?



No I will not open and I cant bid later. I am not saying its perfect, but I think it helps us do well on the swingy hands (where each side has a big fit in a major). And quite often when you have no support and couldnt open you dont want to bid anyway. I mean if you didnt have 4 you would have opened 2/3 right? If I had the same hand a xx in !h I would X.
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#27 User is offline   bluecalm 

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Posted 2012-August-24, 11:43

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This is a major problem with playing 2-way bids or wide ranging transfers in competition


I like this point.I think you are right.
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#28 User is offline   dake50 

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Posted 2012-August-24, 19:01

This is a major problem with playing 2-way bids or wide ranging transfers in competition. It sounds nice because you have a bid for everything, but if there is more bidding than partner doesn't know what you have.

*** Do you mean partner won't be able to continue with a good D-fit?
Nor will I announce a H-fit after showing Diamonds?
Aren't we well out of this auction having no fit for above 4S?
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#29 User is offline   jogs 

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Posted 2012-August-25, 16:13

View Posthan, on 2012-August-24, 08:49, said:

OK, nicely done making both suits minors. But what if you held Axxx x Kxxxxxx x in first seat, would you open that? If not and if it goes

p - 1C - 1H - 3C
??

can you then bid your diamonds?


I held a similar hand in a sectional against strong opponents.
None, as dealer I held Qxxx, xx, __ , KQT9xxx

4 - X - p - 4
4 - 5 - 5 - all pass

5 went down one. At the other table our teammates played 4 making.
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