[Fluffy]

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-90 was not as good as +110

[phil_20686]

Why didn't east just bid a NT? I realise the stop isnt ideal, but you know you are going to be in a tough spot if you dble. Besides, 1d is often just a balanced hand, no point worrying about stops as much if they might only have 3 diamonds.

[TimG]

phil_20686, on 2012-June-01, 09:04, said:

Why didn't east just bid a NT? I realise the stop isnt ideal, but you know you are going to be in a tough spot if you dble. Besides, 1d is often just a balanced hand, no point worrying about stops as much if they might only have 3 diamonds.

What percentage of the time do they only have three diamonds? I imagine you are right about 1NT, but I would be thinking "they might only have 3 or 4 diamonds".

[Cyberyeti]

Would have overcalled 1N, but having Xd I'd X again, sounds like partner probably has 5 clubs, depends how much he needs to bid 2M over 2♦.

[mikeh]

If you can't take 6 tricks on defence, can't they always manage 5 when they defend?

Yes, I can see that it is easy to lose one's way....if spades are 3-3 and clubs 3-2, you can't cash many hearts before switching...on some layouts, you have to switch at trick 2 and on others at trick 3.

As for their defending...if the reason they make 90 is that spades are 4-2, then they can always get a spade ruff unless clubs are 4-1.

I wonder if there would have been an ATB re the bidding if the defence had been perfect (assuming you can beat 2♦) or if the opps had gone +100 against 3♣.

As for overcalling 1N, how does that help if S bids 2♦? Is West, red, going to push to 3♣, with partner usually holding diamond cards?

[phil_20686]

mikeh, on 2012-June-01, 09:22, said:

If you can't take 6 tricks on defence, can't they always manage 5 when they defend?

Yes, I can see that it is easy to lose one's way....if spades are 3-3 and clubs 3-2, you can't cash many hearts before switching...on some layouts, you have to switch at trick 2 and on others at trick 3.

As for their defending...if the reason they make 90 is that spades are 4-2, then they can always get a spade ruff unless clubs are 4-1.

I wonder if there would have been an ATB re the bidding if the defence had been perfect (assuming you can beat 2♦) or if the opps had gone +100 against 3♣.

As for overcalling 1N, how does that help if S bids 2♦? Is West, red, going to push to 3♣, with partner usually holding diamond cards?

I imagine west will dble and east will bid 2S. seems like a reasonable spot. They might take the push to 3d.

[ArtK78]

phil_20686, on 2012-June-01, 10:32, said:

I imagine west will dble and east will bid 2S. seems like a reasonable spot. They might take the push to 3d.

West will double? That seems pretty aggressive on a more or less balanced 5 count. I can't imagine that East would do anything except possibly compete to 3♣. And that is quite a position to take.

Any action that East takes could easily turn a plus into a minus. That is one possible benefit to doubling - when 2♦ goes down it will certainly improve the score. But -180 is also a possibility if East doubles.

[gszes]

Fluffy, on 2012-June-01, 09:01, said:

---

-90 was not as good as +110

AT MP i can see passing--not willing to go -100 vs -90

AT IMPS this consdieration is almost trivial and x is called
for not just because you might make something but because the opps
might go to the three level and you can set them. This is almost a risk
free 2nd x p will never leave it in (they are relatively short in dia)..

I personally hate the 1n overcall because p still can raise to 3n and be
upset over the quality of your dia stopper too much risk.

[nigel_k]

I agree with East's double and the final pass. With the West hand I would prefer to give up a natural 2NT and be able to show a good or bad hand with clubs. No blame otherwise.

[jdeegan]

I think E should double a second time. He knows that pard is "short" in ♦ - at worst a doubleton. Therefore, he must have a four card major or five clubs. Imo, you simply can't sell out with 17 HCP even though pard didn't bid over 2♦. Can it lose? Of course, but we are playing a game of percentages, esp. at MP's.

[mike777]

Agree with the comments that whatever you cant let the opp play in 2d on this auction.

they clearly have at least an 8 card fit in d at the two level.

[lycier]

Fluffy, on 2012-June-01, 09:01, said:

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-90 was not as good as +110

I think after 2d, E can do responsive double maybe is a good option. when partner rebid 2s, it could pass.

[Zelandakh]

jdeegan, on 2012-June-02, 20:14, said:

I think E should double a second time. He knows that pard is "short" in ♦ - at worst a doubleton.

Knows? Have you never had opponents open 1♦ with 4432 and their partners raised with 4? Worse, if partner is short and did not act they must have pretty much rubbish. Therefore I would certainly not double a second time as East. On the other hand a double from West is possible on thr "hand with shortage acts" principle. At these colours it is hardly obligatory though - Game All is the worst time for taking marginal actions at MP. As gszes wrote, -100 is a potential disaster against -90.

[mr1303]

I always raise diamonds on 4 and sometimes on 3 if I think the hand warrants it, particularly over a double.

[Codo]

I had bid the E/W hands exactly like this pair did. Yes 1 NT or an artifical 2 NT had helped, but without this particular agreement, I had defend 2♦ as well.