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another 4NT takeout never works

#1 User is offline   pigpenz 

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Posted 2012-May-14, 08:18


at my table I doubled they made 5
another person tried the 4NT take out approach which worked
4NT-6 against their vuln game.

so how do you get GIB to bid over 4 with a two suiter?
granted this isnt the greatest two suiter but somewhere there has to
be a system for GIB to play.
I always thought

x=generally penalties
4NT=take out

it seems there is no way at this time to play takeout over these types of pre empts.
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#2 User is offline   Bbradley62 

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Posted 2012-May-14, 08:22

It appears that the problem is that the 4N bid is not at all in GIB's bidding database, since there is no explanation provided for it.
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#3 User is offline   Stephen Tu 

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Posted 2012-May-14, 12:04

The double = penalties thing vs. preemptive openings and raised preempts went extinct among better players decades ago. Double = 3-suited takeout, 4nt = 2-suited takeout should be standard and what GIB ought to use. 2-suited being 5-5 at least.


Of course I think either action by the South hand on the actual hand is nuts. Although you get out the miracle 500 vs. 650 on the actual auction and vulnerability, and robot opps may not know how to double you, I think in the long run you'll take too many phantoms for this to be + EV.
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#4 User is offline   pigpenz 

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Posted 2012-May-14, 12:27

View PostStephen Tu, on 2012-May-14, 12:04, said:

The double = penalties thing vs. preemptive openings and raised preempts went extinct among better players decades ago. Double = 3-suited takeout, 4nt = 2-suited takeout should be standard and what GIB ought to use. 2-suited being 5-5 at least.


Of course I think either action by the South hand on the actual hand is nuts. Although you get out the miracle 500 vs. 650 on the actual auction and vulnerability, and robot opps may not know how to double you, I think in the long run you'll take too many phantoms for this to be + EV.

yes I understand but like I posted on a earlier post thread header
I had similar auction was passed hand then on 5-5 hand bid 4NT and GIB passed.
granted I took a unilateral call by bidding 4NT I crapped in my pants when GIB passed.

since what you and I have posted earlier this is pretty standard on what most people play over high level pre empts
in fact doesnt the old convention card have a spot marked for what doubles mean over 4 and 4 and
what is take out for over 4. seems sort of weird that this would be left out of the GIB database.
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