[whereagles]

Hi all. I have the following idea that I'd like to discuss with you.

It has become common practice to play wide-ranging weak jump overcalls. This means you can overcall a 1♥ opener by RHO at non-vuln vs vuln with, say..

A. ♠AQJxx ♥JTxx ♦Kxx ♣x
B. ♠AQxxxx ♥xxx ♦xxx ♣x

Now pard has ♠Kxx ♥x ♦Axxx ♣xxxxx and he wants to know whether you hold hand A or B, so that he can save in 4♠ or pass 4♥. Suppose LHO acts and the bidding goes

RHO you LHO pard
1♥...2♠...3♥...??

This one is easy: you're fairly sure opener is going to bid 4♥, so a save-suggesting move is in order. Therefore you double 3♥, asking pard to bid 4♠ with a hand that looks like B, and to pass (or double!) 4♥ with a hand like A. (Should opener pass the double, pard is of course requested to bid 3♠.)

Now suppose you play not only wide-ranging weak jump overcalls, but also wide-ranging weak two openings. The weak two is 5-10 and it can be 5 or 6 cards, possibly with a few defensive values. The question would be: if we open before opponents, is it a good idea to have save-suggesting bids? That is to say, is it worth to suggest a save at the expense of leaving opponents with more ways to describe their hands? Let us take the above example. Suppose it goes instead

Pard RHO you LHO
2♠...pass...??

Suppose 3♥ now is a save-suggesting bid. Is it a good idea to do it and hear, say...

Pard RHO you LHO
2♠...pass...3♥...3♠ (good take-out of spades)
2♠...pass...3♥...dbl (5-card heart suit, opening values)

Wouldn't it be better to just blast 3♠ and watch opps guess whether to bid 4♥ over
Pard RHO you LHO
2♠...pass...3♠...?? (Double..? or bid 4♥)

Playing like this you would lose the occasional sacrifice, but you'd also make opponents go astray more often. Note that the situation is quite different from the first case. There opponents had already bid something (1♥). Here they're completely in the dark.

Of course, having the tools doesn't mean you NEED to use them. You could save them for an appropriate occasion, where it is clear from your hand opponents will bid something. But in any case, the question is: after a wide-ranging weak two opening, do you think it's worth to relieve some of the pressure over opponents to gain precision in your sacrifices?

[luke warm]

whereagles, on Nov 5 2004, 01:08 PM, said:

Hi all. I have the following idea that I'd like to discuss with you.

It has become common practice to play wide-ranging weak jump overcalls. This means you can overcall a 1♥ opener by RHO at non-vuln vs vuln with, say..

A. ♠AQJxx ♥JTxx ♦Kxx ♣x
B. ♠AQxxxx ♥xxx ♦xxx ♣x

Now pard has ♠Kxx ♥x ♦Axxx ♣xxxxx and he wants to know whether you hold hand A or B, so that he can save in 4♠ or pass 4♥. Suppose LHO acts and the bidding goes

RHO you LHO pard
1♥...2♠...3♥...??

This one is easy: you're fairly sure opener is going to bid 4♥, so a save-suggesting move is in order. Therefore you double 3♥, asking pard to bid 4♠ with a hand that looks like B, and to pass (or double!) 4♥ with a hand like A. (Should opener pass the double, pard is of course requested to bid 3♠.)

Now suppose you play not only wide-ranging weak jump overcalls, but also wide-ranging weak two openings. The weak two is 5-10 and it can be 5 or 6 cards, possibly with a few defensive values. The question would be: if we open before opponents, is it a good idea to have save-suggesting bids? That is to say, is it worth to suggest a save at the expense of leaving opponents with more ways to describe their hands? Let us take the above example. Suppose it goes instead

Pard RHO you LHO
2♠...pass...??

Suppose 3♥ now is a save-suggesting bid. Is it a good idea to do it and hear, say...

Pard RHO you LHO
2♠...pass...3♥...3♠ (good take-out of spades)
2♠...pass...3♥...dbl (5-card heart suit, opening values)

Wouldn't it be better to just blast 3♠ and watch opps guess whether to bid 4♥ over
Pard RHO you LHO
2♠...pass...3♠...?? (Double..? or bid 4♥)

Playing like this you would lose the occasional sacrifice, but you'd also make opponents go astray more often. Note that the situation is quite different from the first case. There opponents had already bid something (1♥). Here they're completely in the dark.

Of course, having the tools doesn't mean you NEED to use them. You could save them for an appropriate occasion, where it is clear from your hand opponents will bid something. But in any case, the question is: after a wide-ranging weak two opening, do you think it's worth to relieve some of the pressure over opponents to gain precision in your sacrifices?

holding the 'A' hand, don't jump overcall.. imo it's too strong... with the bidding shown, and holding hand 'B', i think your partner should bid 3S... 17 minimum total tricks, probably more... i think an overcall here is odds on

i'll defer to someone else on the weak 2 question