Help
Would you respond 2♥ on a hand like this, or wait and see what happens after 1♦? (Scoring is IMPs if relevant.)
Page 1 of 1
constructive 2M response to strong 1C on Axxxxx
#1
- Group: Full Members
- Posts: 104
- Joined: 2006-March-26
Posted 2012-March-27, 23:17
Suppose you play a fairly traditional Precision system including the agreement that over 1♣, 2♥ shows "6+ hearts, with 4 to 6 HCPs, mostly in the heart suit".
Would you respond 2♥ on a hand like this, or wait and see what happens after 1♦? (Scoring is IMPs if relevant.)
Would you respond 2♥ on a hand like this, or wait and see what happens after 1♦? (Scoring is IMPs if relevant.)
#2
- Group: Advanced Members
- Posts: 4,942
- Joined: 2005-January-28
- Gender:Male
- Location:Cologne, Germany
- Interests:Sleeping, Eating
Posted 2012-March-28, 00:37
Well let's see, do I have 6+ hearts? Yes. Do I have 4 to 6 HCP? Yes. Are they mostly in the heart suit? Uhm, well, yes.
So, uh.... WTP?
So, uh.... WTP?
"One of the painful things about our time is that those who feel certainty are stupid, and those with any imagination and understanding are filled with doubt and indecision"
-- Bertrand Russell
-- Bertrand Russell
#3
- Group: Advanced Members
- Posts: 1,627
- Joined: 2009-November-30
- Location:Oxfordshire, England
Posted 2012-March-28, 01:36
mgoetze, on 2012-March-28, 00:37, said:
Well let's see, do I have 6+ hearts? Yes. Do I have 4 to 6 HCP? Yes. Are they mostly in the heart suit? Uhm, well, yes.
So, uh.... WTP?
So, uh.... WTP?
The problem, I think, is that the description given for the bid is a guide to what it shows, not a definitive demarcation between hands which are bid that way and hands that aren't. For me, the hand has too much potential for playing elsewhere compared with its potential in hearts for this to be a sensible way to try to describe the hand, and I would rather bid 1♦. Make the heart suit KJ10xxx rather than Axxxxx and now I agree with WTP.
#4
- Group: Advanced Members
- Posts: 3,465
- Joined: 2006-January-07
- Location:Montreal Canada
- Interests:All games. i really mean all of them.
Posted 2012-March-28, 01:49
I simply dont understand why people are not playing transfers at the 2 level over 1C,
allow you to have 2 ranges/wider range (3-5) or GF for example.
+ You are rightsiding all this for the modest cost of smaller preemption and needing 1nt to show clubs but getting 2S free.
allow you to have 2 ranges/wider range (3-5) or GF for example.
+ You are rightsiding all this for the modest cost of smaller preemption and needing 1nt to show clubs but getting 2S free.
From Psych "I mean, Gus and I never see eye-to-eye on work stuff.
For instance, he doesn't like being used as a human shield when we're being shot at.
I happen to think it's a very noble way to meet one's maker, especially for a guy like him.
Bottom line is we never let that difference of opinion interfere with anything."
For instance, he doesn't like being used as a human shield when we're being shot at.
I happen to think it's a very noble way to meet one's maker, especially for a guy like him.
Bottom line is we never let that difference of opinion interfere with anything."
#5
- Group: Advanced Members
- Posts: 3,465
- Joined: 2006-January-07
- Location:Montreal Canada
- Interests:All games. i really mean all of them.
Posted 2012-March-28, 01:49
I simply dont understand why people are not playing transfers at the 2 level over 1C,
allow you to have 2 ranges/wider range (3-5) or GF for example.
+ You are rightsiding all this for the modest cost of smaller preemption and needing 1nt to show clubs but getting 2S free.
allow you to have 2 ranges/wider range (3-5) or GF for example.
+ You are rightsiding all this for the modest cost of smaller preemption and needing 1nt to show clubs but getting 2S free.
From Psych "I mean, Gus and I never see eye-to-eye on work stuff.
For instance, he doesn't like being used as a human shield when we're being shot at.
I happen to think it's a very noble way to meet one's maker, especially for a guy like him.
Bottom line is we never let that difference of opinion interfere with anything."
For instance, he doesn't like being used as a human shield when we're being shot at.
I happen to think it's a very noble way to meet one's maker, especially for a guy like him.
Bottom line is we never let that difference of opinion interfere with anything."
#6
- Group: Advanced Members
- Posts: 1,528
- Joined: 2008-December-02
Posted 2012-March-28, 05:23
benlessard, on 2012-March-28, 01:49, said:
I simply dont understand why people are not playing transfers at the 2 level over 1C,
allow you to have 2 ranges/wider range (3-5) or GF for example.
+ You are rightsiding all this for the modest cost of smaller preemption and needing 1nt to show clubs but getting 2S free.
allow you to have 2 ranges/wider range (3-5) or GF for example.
+ You are rightsiding all this for the modest cost of smaller preemption and needing 1nt to show clubs but getting 2S free.
Doesn't that mean you have to sacrifice 2♦ as natural.
#7
- Group: Advanced Members
- Posts: 15,396
- Joined: 2003-February-13
- Gender:Male
- Location:Natick, MA
-
Interests:Travel
Cooking
Brewing
Hiking
Posted 2012-March-28, 06:47
mgoetze, on 2012-March-28, 00:37, said:
Well let's see, do I have 6+ hearts? Yes. Do I have 4 to 6 HCP? Yes. Are they mostly in the heart suit? Uhm, well, yes.
So, uh.... WTP?
So, uh.... WTP?
What he said...
Equally important, if you start with 1♦ partner is never going to play you for this hand...
Alderaan delenda est
#8
- Group: Advanced Members
- Posts: 3,465
- Joined: 2006-January-07
- Location:Montreal Canada
- Interests:All games. i really mean all of them.
Posted 2012-March-28, 07:08
Quote
Doesn't that mean you have to sacrifice 2♦ as natural.
2C become a transfer to diamonds. (for us its 0-bad5 or GF) but you could play any range. Rightsiding here is just great and for game/slams its fun to see them lead in an mostly unknown hand.
From Psych "I mean, Gus and I never see eye-to-eye on work stuff.
For instance, he doesn't like being used as a human shield when we're being shot at.
I happen to think it's a very noble way to meet one's maker, especially for a guy like him.
Bottom line is we never let that difference of opinion interfere with anything."
For instance, he doesn't like being used as a human shield when we're being shot at.
I happen to think it's a very noble way to meet one's maker, especially for a guy like him.
Bottom line is we never let that difference of opinion interfere with anything."
#9
- Group: Advanced Members
- Posts: 3,465
- Joined: 2006-January-07
- Location:Montreal Canada
- Interests:All games. i really mean all of them.
Posted 2012-March-28, 07:08
Quote
Doesn't that mean you have to sacrifice 2♦ as natural.
2C become a transfer to diamonds. (for us its 0-bad5 or GF) but you could play any range. Rightsiding here is just great and for game/slams its fun to see them lead in an mostly unknown hand.
From Psych "I mean, Gus and I never see eye-to-eye on work stuff.
For instance, he doesn't like being used as a human shield when we're being shot at.
I happen to think it's a very noble way to meet one's maker, especially for a guy like him.
Bottom line is we never let that difference of opinion interfere with anything."
For instance, he doesn't like being used as a human shield when we're being shot at.
I happen to think it's a very noble way to meet one's maker, especially for a guy like him.
Bottom line is we never let that difference of opinion interfere with anything."
#10
- Group: Advanced Members
- Posts: 4,942
- Joined: 2005-January-28
- Gender:Male
- Location:Cologne, Germany
- Interests:Sleeping, Eating
Posted 2012-March-28, 07:23
WellSpyder, on 2012-March-28, 01:36, said:
For me, the hand has too much potential for playing elsewhere compared with its potential in hearts for this to be a sensible way to try to describe the hand,
Oh, partner is not allowed to bid 2♠ over this? Maybe tell me more about the followups.
"One of the painful things about our time is that those who feel certainty are stupid, and those with any imagination and understanding are filled with doubt and indecision"
-- Bertrand Russell
-- Bertrand Russell
#11
- Csaba the Hutt
-
- Group: Advanced Members
- Posts: 13,027
- Joined: 2006-June-16
- Gender:Male
- Location:Göttingen, Germany
- Interests:bye
Posted 2012-March-28, 07:27
mgoetze, on 2012-March-28, 07:23, said:
Oh, partner is not allowed to bid 2♠ over this? Maybe tell me more about the followups.
This hand is worth probably 2 tricks more in a spade contract than an average 2♥ bid, so it will be the case from time to time that partner passes 2♥ when we have 4♠ on. That said, 2♥ is probably the best description we can hope for. Even if partner rebids 1♠ over 1♣-1♦, we won't be in such a great position. Of course this depends a bit on the follow-ups.
... and I can prove it with my usual, flawless logic.
George Carlin
George Carlin
#12
- Secretary Bird
-
- Group: Advanced Members
- Posts: 7,149
- Joined: 2003-July-12
- Gender:Male
- Location:Calgary, D18; Chapala, D16
Posted 2012-March-28, 15:08
Well, I don't have this problem. 2M for me shows HHxxxx and out, and it's "3-6"; A9xxxx isn't two honours, and AKxxxx and out is a GF positive.
But I don't know the answer to this, because (like everyone else is saying) the Ace and the spades are great for a spade contract, and this call is supposed to be "partner, I'm useless outside of hearts". If I was AJ so I could think of this, I don't know what I'd do; if I was AQ, I'd probably start 1♦ and hope I don't confuse.
But I don't know the answer to this, because (like everyone else is saying) the Ace and the spades are great for a spade contract, and this call is supposed to be "partner, I'm useless outside of hearts". If I was AJ so I could think of this, I don't know what I'd do; if I was AQ, I'd probably start 1♦ and hope I don't confuse.
When I go to sea, don't fear for me, Fear For The Storm -- Birdie and the Swansong (tSCoSI)
#13
- Group: Advanced Members
- Posts: 4,073
- Joined: 2009-January-18
- Gender:Male
- Location:Vancouver WA USA
Posted 2012-March-28, 15:24
I think 1C-2H for 4-7 with six hearts is wasteful. I'd rather respond 1D (0-7) and then show hearts.
Page 1 of 1