[Chamaco]

Both this post and the companion post on Precision 2D could be read as
"How do you set the trump suit for slam purposes, before this looks like a signoff with 3-suited hand?"

------------------------------
Hi all,
I'd like to hear opinions on the development of the the strong 3-suited option of the Multi 2D opener, used for 4441 17-20.

Assume you have, as responder, a constructive hand, and after inquiring and finding out opener is a strong 3 suiter, you have some slam prospects.

I'll try to build an example hand

IMPS, none vuln, you hold

ATxx-xx-KQTxx-Jx

Bidding uncontested

2D* : 2H**
3C***:?

* = weak 2 in a major/ 4441 18-20 any singleton
**= to play if weak 2 in H; can be still quite a good hand, constructive if the weak 2 is in spades
***= diamonds singleton

Now 3D would ask for controls.


Aftert pard's 3-suited opening, responder has some view of slam despite some wasted values in diamonds.
His plan should be:

1) set trumps
2) ask for key cards
3) MOST IMPORTANT, ask for trump Q

We can see that the most important thinbg is to set the trump suit without signing off, so that RKCB can do the job.


How do we set spades as trump without signing off ?
If we bid 3 spades, it is a partscore signoff (since 2H coulsd still be a yarborough).
If we bid clubs pard will think the strain is clubs.
If we bid 4 diamonds, I have no idea what that would mean (3D is for controls)
If we bid 3D and thenm 4D at the 2nd round, I have no idea either.

The scheme of 3-suited Multi is taken from Anderson/Zenkel, but these development are not discussed.

[Free]

Here as well, you can use low-level RKC (see other post)...

[Chamaco]

Free, on Oct 13 2004, 02:39 PM, said:

Here as well, you can use low-level RKC (see other post)...

2D:2H
3C: ?

Here 3D step can be used (bidding the known singleton; that should used as asking for no. of controls, but this could be changed), but 3H and 3S cannot be used as steps, they will be signoff bids if 2H comes from a yarborough.
We need to be able to stop in 3 of a suit if responder is weak, so 3 level bids except bidding the singleton cannot be used.

[whereagles]

I used to play multi with a 16-23 4441 variant. After a 2H/S response, opener would bid the suit below the singleton (with 2D-2S-3S sing club).

Responder could then sign-off, or bid the singleton, which could be done 3 times:
1. Ask point range
2. Ask roman controls
3. Queen ask

Random example:

AKJx....xxxx
AJxx....x
QJxx....AKxxx
x.........Axx

2D 2H
2NT 3C
3D 4C
4H 5C
5H 6D (6S in pairs, maybe)

Club bids asked, and non-club bids would be sign-offs. To play clubs you need to jump (2D-2H-2NT-4C = very weak, long solid clubs)

2NT = strong, club sing
3D = 16-17. 3H would show 18-19, etc.
4H = 5 controls. If 16-19 hcp starts at 4, if 20-23 starts at 5.
5H = one queen. Doesn't tell you which queen, though, so here's someting you can improve. If opener had shown two queens e.g. AKQx Axxx QJxx x, resp could take a shot at 7.

Well, dunno if this is good, but it's how I used to play it a loooooong time ago

[Chamaco]

What do you think of transfer followups ?

2D:2H
3C(diam sngltn): ?

3D = weak/strong xfer to H, if bidding progresses, it's a slam try in H with all gadgets we have agreed once set the trump suit

3H = weak/strong xfer to S

3S = weak/strong xfer to C (note we doi not have a yarborough, otherwise we'd pass 3C)
-----------------------------

This is easy when we have all the 3-level available but:

2D:2H
3S(clubs sngltn): ?

seems more awkward: less space to look for slam, and we are forced to 4 of a suit even if p has nothing.

Opinions ?
Do you think this xfer scheme would work for the same problem also after Precision 2D opener ?

[Free]

Ah ok, I thought we were in a GF auction when we have a 3-suited hand with 17-20 HCP

You can use the step 1 as you said to ask controls or so, and make the bidding GF. After the controls, you don't need RKC anymore imo. Since you're in a GF auction, you might set the trump after controls are given in a similar way, and also keep 3NT and 4♦ as special bids. This way opener can immediatly show if he has the Q or not, and perhaps some other Queen if he has the trump Q.

Example after the trump has been set:
step 1 = no trump Q
step 2 = trump Q and a specific Q
...

After this, every bid in the trump suit from responder (not opener) is to play, all others are asking bids.

[inquiry]

I don't want to play (answer) under these conditions..... but this time, you didn't but in RED restrictions... so might I suggest a slight alteration?

2D-2H
2NT <--- use this to be your three suiter. Responder bids

3D <--- try to get out in diamonds with bust (can have D, D+S, D+C)
3H <--- try to get out in spades and clubs with a bust
3S <--- willing to play opposite stiff spade with a bust

I assume that 1) responder will not be long in hearts (else 2S?)..
The theory of these three escape bids is that opener will pass with fit, bid up line with out.

This frees up 3C to be ask for short suit. Responses would be

3D = short heart
3H = short spade
3S = short minor, minimum
3NT = short minor, maximum

Responder can then set the contract by not bidding rely, or can bid relay 2D-2H-2N-3C-3D-3H, to ask for more information. I suspect first info might should be minimum or maximum, and then next cue-bid short suit (or notrump, whichever is cheaper) is asking for Controls (A=2, K=1), starting with 5. Then you can do queen denial ask to find missing queens....

This isn't totally off the top of my head, this is similar to what I play on the auction... 2C-2D-2NT where I use 2NT to show 3 suiter (but I can be 5440), and MUCH stronger than 20, or a tad weaker than 17.

Ben

[pclayton]

I used to play this in a strong club partnership a few years ago. 2D was a 4441 with 17-20 or 21+ or 22-23 / 26-27 balanced. Rebids after 2H:

2S - stiff club, lower range
2N - natural, 22-23 balanced
3C - stiff diamond lower
3D - stiff heart lower
3H - stiff spade lower
3S - stiff club, upper range
3N - 26-27 balanced
4C - stiff diamond, upper, etc....

Loading the balanced hands didn't seem to hurt the effectiveness of the bid, and allowed us not to load any of the balanced hands onto the 1C - 1D - 1H sequences (both 1C-1D-1H and 1C-1D-1S were one round forces and natural). Balanced 20-21 hands we bid 1C-1D-2H.

I don't specifically remember the rebids, but its a bit odd for the weak hand to assume captaincy on these auctions.

I never was really that fond of the structure anyway. I think 2D is better served as short diamonds in a strong club environment.