[sceptic]

Scoring: IMP

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West North East South

 -     -     -     1NT
 2♥    2NT   Pass  3♣
 Dbl   3♥    Pass  3NT
 Pass  Pass  Pass  

we were playing lebensohl, what did we do wrong.. particualr emphasis on the 3 heart understanding please

[hrothgar]

there was an early thread from a day or two back asking about critical skills for competitive bidding. I noted that I considered hand evaluation to be the foundation for everything coming afterwards....

This example is a good illustration of this point:

North has no business establishing a game force opposite a "standard" 15-17 HCP 1NT opening. North has an eight count. While the 1♥ overcall strong suggests that the King of hearts is going to be over the Ace, at the same time this honor won't be contributing to establishing additional winner's in opener's hand. The Jack of hearts is completely wasted.

If you're worried about conventions/agreements:

I don't know what you partner was trying to show with lebensohl followed by a cue bid. It might have been Stayman, however, most people use a direct cue as asking for a 4 card major. In either case, North is too weak.

Personally, I prefer to play negative doubles after 2 level intervention after our NT opening. Would have worked well on this hand...

[inquiry]

There was one mistake here and one very aggressive view.

Let's deal with the mistake. This auction (2NT followed by 3H) is stayman, and promises a heart stopper. Opener with four spades, should steer the contact into the known 4-4 major fit I guess.

The aggreesive view. North has only 8 hcp, includign four in teh opponents suit, yet he forced to game with this auciton. Let's see 16+8 = 24 with opponents strong hand behind openr, 15+8 is even worse. I believe forcing to game with north's hand is much too aggressive.

But you are probably not playing negative doubles here (dbl of 2H shows some values, not enough to force to game per se). Here you would get to a comfortable 2S... or you might strech and get to 4S that is somewhat unlucky to go down

1N-(2H)-X-(P)
2S-(?)- Pass PASS,

or

1N-(2H)-X-(P)
2S-(?)-3S-P
Pass/4S <<--- up to your evalation....

Ben

[pclayton]

The 2N followed by 3♥ in standard Lebensohl is Stayman with a stopper. I am mystified why the 1N opener did not agree spades at this point.

North took a very rosy view of the 8 count. Its the double fit that makes game just so-so; I don't think its that great a contract on the auction.

Easy negative double if you play them at the 2 level; otherwise its a MP 2♠ call.

And don't feel too bad; 4♥ is rolling if declarer takes the correct view on the play.

[sceptic]

the reason I missed the spades defies me, I had a blonde moment and thought p was looking for stop this is what happens when you start using conventions and rarely get the opportunity to use them, but at least this time I realised it was lebensohl, so I am improving )

[Flame]

I think 3nt is better contract then 4sp here, maybe only when no vul. (not that they shouldnt have bid 4sp)

[1eyedjack]

hrothgar, on Sep 28 2004, 12:32 PM, said:

The Jack of hearts is completely wasted.

The Heart Jack is wasted only because it falls under partner's Ace. Give partner Axx or Qxx or Txxx and it is working. Otherwise I agree with Hrothgar. Double 2H for takeout, and then play Lebensohl response to the double to investigate game.

[junyi_zhu]

sceptic, on Sep 28 2004, 05:15 PM, said:

Scoring: IMP

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West North East South

- - - 1NT
2♥ 2NT Pass 3♣
Dbl 3♥ Pass 3NT
Pass Pass Pass

we were playing lebensohl, what did we do wrong.. particualr emphasis on the 3 heart understanding please

South made one mistake: she should bid 3S over 3H because 3H is stayman with heart
stopper. Besides that, everything is OK if you don't play takeout double at two level.
North has no much choice if you play leb and penalty double at two level. North has to stretch a little bit with her soso 8 HCP hand. Also, if you play takeout double, you may
eventually end up at 4S -2. It may go like this:
1N 2H x p 3S p 4S all pass.

[the hog]

Agree with most posters that you should play takeout doubles over overcalls on 1NT. South can now bid 2S and Nth can maybe raise to 3S, all pass.