[han]

What are your thoughts about making a two-suited overcalls when one suit is much better and/or longer than the other?

Here are two example hands I encountered somewhat recently:

AJ9xxx
J1098x
xx
-

Playing in a knock-out team game in the New York nationals, I passed in second seat, LHO opened a precision 2C (at least 5 clubs, 11-15 pts) and RHO inquired with 2D (showing game interest). Everybody was vulnerabe. Given that you play 3C as both majors, would you bid 2S or 3C. (I bid 2S)


You may not believe it, but at some sectional swiss in Ohio, my partner had xxxxx - AKQJxxxx -. His RHO opened 1H in first seat, would you use Michaels? (he did, I don't remember the vulnerability)

[whereagles]

Depends. If one of the suits is very solid and independent, I usually consider it a 1-suiter. Otherwise it's a two-suiter.

With 1st hand, I'd bid michaels. With 2nd I wouldn't.

[bearmum]

Hannie, on Sep 20 2004, 11:14 AM, said:

What are your thoughts about making a two-suited overcalls when one suit is much better and/or longer than the other?

Here are two example hands I encountered somewhat recently:

AJ9xxx
J1098x
xx
-

Playing in a knock-out team game in the New York nationals, I passed in second seat, LHO opened a precision 2C (at least 5 clubs, 11-15 pts) and RHO inquired with 2D (showing game interest). Everybody was vulnerabe. Given that you play 3C as both majors, would you bid 2S or 3C. (I bid 2S)


You may not believe it, but at some sectional swiss in Ohio, my partner had xxxxx - AKQJxxxx -. His RHO opened 1H in first seat, would you use Michaels? (he did, I don't remember the vulnerability)

Problem 1 - I would use Michaels

Problem 2 I would bid diamonds

[Dwayne]

I think this hand is the wrong strength for a 2-suited overcall. If you Michaels and partner bids 2 of wither Major, you've to make a game try - however, a rebid by the Michaels biider usually indicated some sort of 16+ or thereabouts.

I overcall 1S.

However, I note you passed with this hand. I think you have to open these hands. If you havent a 2-level two-suited gadget then open 1S.

Imagine if you pass and LHO opens 5C? You could easily make 5M or a slam opposite not much.

Dwayne-da-rat.

[whereagles]

Dwayne, I would advise a bit more flexibility in free bids by overcaller. E.g. something like, say,

(1H) 2H (3H) pass
pass ...??

3S = 6S-5m or 66. Weakish hand with extra distribution
3NT = 5S-6m. Still a weakish hand
4C/D = 5S-7m. Weakish
X = STRONG 55
4H = strong 66
4S = strong 6S-5m
4NT = strong 5S-6m
5C/D = strong 5S-7m

[Flame]

You should try not to bid a 2 suiter bid with uneven suits, you should never bid it with 2 cards apart, like 6-4 or 7-5, with only 1 card different dont do it if the longer suit has soft values, that need work on them, for example if you have in your long suit AJxxx its fine, but if you have KQ10 or KQJ or KQ or QJ10 its not.

[Free]

If I have 2 suits and they're really different strength-wise, then I'll just bid my good suit and throw away my poor suit. It's no use to intervene and give away the hand to opps if you can't handle any of both suits lead by partner. Also with 6-4 or 7-5 you shouldn't treat it as a 2-suiter unless the longest suit is AWFUL and the shorter suit is pure power (like 9876542 opposite AKQxx in another suit).

With the first hand I'll overcall 2♠ (but change that small ♠ in a small ♥ and 3♣ would be more attractive).

Second hand is a clear Dbl. If partner bids ♥ you can play in a 5-4 fit (possibly slam), if he doesn't bid ♥, treat it as a singlesuited hand with ♦ and rebid ♥ afterwards if you still have room

[flytoox]

Mike Lawrence suggested briefly that if high ranking suit has better quality, treat it as single suit hand. If low ranking suit has better quality, treat it as two suiter and bid michael or whatever.

Pls refer to Dynamic defense, though he didnt say much about this.

[cherdano]

With the second hand, how about using Michaels, and then bidding diamonds on the cheapest level? Should this show this type of hand (5 spades and longer and better diamonds)?

But I like Free's solution with the "2way-double" as well.

[inquiry]

Flame, on Sep 20 2004, 06:36 AM, said:

You should try not to bid a 2 suiter bid with uneven suits, you should never bid it with 2 cards apart, like 6-4 or 7-5, with only 1 card different dont do it if the longer suit has soft values, that need work on them, for example if you have in your long suit AJxxx its fine, but if you have KQ10 or KQJ or KQ or QJ10 its not.

While this is excellent (or at least very sound) advice, I have a few words to say.

The first is that I play raptor, where my 1NT overcall shows four card major and longer minor. So that is a violation of this rule. Second, playing dont and even meckwell, I will make overcalls over 1NT with 4-5 and 4-6 and 4-4 hands. Third, not vul versus vul, I sometimes get frisky with unusual NT and or michaels and will have a four card suit in there somewhere, particularily if partner is a passed hand. There is a risk in this of course, if you use a two suited hand at this vul without the two suits, you are at a greater risk of partner taking an expensive "save" thinking you have more distribution (he is more likely to bid on over their game when you are white and they are red).... so do this 4-card two suiter with full knowldedge that you may have some "explaining to do" if partner gets frisky here.

Ben

[Flame]

Ben if you have a bid that show 5 card minor and 4 card major you should oviously use it. I see nothing bad in it, since partner know what you have.
The main problem with bidding on non even suits is that partner will usually correct to the other suit since he will most of the time have longer suit in our shorter one.
playing 6-2 is better then 4-2 but you cant expect partner not to correct, usually also 5-2 is better then 4-3.
The idea mentioned before that the higher ranking suit shouldnt be the better one , is intresting, and make sense since bidding the higher ranking suit first you will many time be abl to show the lower ranking later, but if you think if the logic i showed before, there is a problem here too, because if we have a better lower ranking partner is more likely to correct it, since the correcting will be on the same bidding level. so this solution isnt too good either.
There is another factor which is how contructive are we in the bidding senario, if we dont care about game and only want to disturb, then bidding a non even two suiter is less of a problem, and bidding it as a two suiter helps preventing a real disaster incase our suit is short in partner's hand, for example against 1nt it make more sense to bid 5-4 as two suiter even if the 4 card are weak.

[luke warm]

Flame, on Sep 20 2004, 12:36 PM, said:

You should try not to bid a 2 suiter bid with uneven suits ~~snip

i disagree with this part... it depends too much on what the opening was... i'm sure a lot of folks will disagree, but what if you have ♥KQ10x and ♦AJxxx and your rho opens 1nt (15-17)... do you bid your DONT 2♦ (or whatever)?

i would, and have, and will again

edit: sorry guys, posted before i read ben's and flame's follow-ups

[Free]

bidding over 1NT is something COMPLETELY different to 1X. Ofcourse we want to intervene their 1NT, but will you bid a Michael's cuebid with that hand after 1♣ or 1♠? Btw, 5-4 is still acceptable unless I promisse a 5 card Major

[whereagles]

That's interesting. It's exactly when the suits are 4M 5m that I find a two-suiter overcall more valuable. With 5M 4m an overcall on the major is a good solution.