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Assume DBL is traditional 4 card ♠
1♣- 1♥-DBL -pass
2♣- pass - 2♠*
1♦ - 1♥-DBL- pass
2♣-pass or 2♥- 2♠*
1♣-1♥-DBL-pass
2♦-pass or 2♥ -2♠*
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What do these bids show ?
#1
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Posted 2011-May-26, 03:03
"Genius has its own limitations, however stupidity has no such boundaries!"
"It's only when a mosquito lands on your testicles that you realize there is always a way to solve problems without using violence!"
"Well to be perfectly honest, in my humble opinion, of course without offending anyone who thinks differently from my point of view, but also by looking into this matter in a different perspective and without being condemning of one's view's and by trying to make it objectified, and by considering each and every one's valid opinion, I honestly believe that I completely forgot what I was going to say."
"It's only when a mosquito lands on your testicles that you realize there is always a way to solve problems without using violence!"
"Well to be perfectly honest, in my humble opinion, of course without offending anyone who thinks differently from my point of view, but also by looking into this matter in a different perspective and without being condemning of one's view's and by trying to make it objectified, and by considering each and every one's valid opinion, I honestly believe that I completely forgot what I was going to say."
#2
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Posted 2011-May-26, 03:32
I guess it could be:
1. 4-card spade suit offering to play in the moysian fit.
2. 5-card spade suit with a very weak hand.
3. 6-card spade suit with a very weak hand.
4. A way for partner to force the bidding.
1 seems interesting, 2 is sort of ridiculous, 3 depends on what you're playing the direct 2♠ to be (if the jump is weak then it cannot be that) and 4 means partner should learn to cue-bid (could he be afraid that a cue-bid sounds like fit+great hand? great two-suiter?).
What I REALLY think it shouldn't be is forcing with 5♠'s (or more) and a strong hand. 1♠ would have been forcing so the 'double then bid' to show a strong hand shouldn't apply here.
1. 4-card spade suit offering to play in the moysian fit.
2. 5-card spade suit with a very weak hand.
3. 6-card spade suit with a very weak hand.
4. A way for partner to force the bidding.
1 seems interesting, 2 is sort of ridiculous, 3 depends on what you're playing the direct 2♠ to be (if the jump is weak then it cannot be that) and 4 means partner should learn to cue-bid (could he be afraid that a cue-bid sounds like fit+great hand? great two-suiter?).
What I REALLY think it shouldn't be is forcing with 5♠'s (or more) and a strong hand. 1♠ would have been forcing so the 'double then bid' to show a strong hand shouldn't apply here.
wyman, on 2012-May-04, 09:48, said:
Also, he rates to not have a heart void when he leads the ♥3.
rbforster, on 2012-May-20, 21:04, said:
Besides playing for fun, most people also like to play bridge to win
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#3
- The Abbess
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Posted 2011-May-26, 03:51
1. is a good 4-card spades (suitable for a Moysian) and the values for a 2NT bid but no heart stopper, or maybe a single heart stopper hoping to make opener declare in notrumps.
2. is the same if overcaller passes, if overcaller bids 2♥ I am not sure, it is probably similar but most hands of this description could have doubled again, so ....
3. again is similar but some play 2♦ here as showing extras while others play it as denying extras. So the values needed for 2NT or 2♠ here will depend on that.
2. is the same if overcaller passes, if overcaller bids 2♥ I am not sure, it is probably similar but most hands of this description could have doubled again, so ....
3. again is similar but some play 2♦ here as showing extras while others play it as denying extras. So the values needed for 2NT or 2♠ here will depend on that.
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#4
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Posted 2011-May-26, 06:59
MrAce, on 2011-May-26, 03:03, said:
Assume DBL is traditional 4 card ♠
1♣- 1♥-DBL -pass
2♣- pass - 2♠*
1♦ - 1♥-DBL- pass
2♣-pass or 2♥- 2♠*
1♣-1♥-DBL-pass
2♦-pass or 2♥ -2♠*
1♣- 1♥-DBL -pass
2♣- pass - 2♠*
1♦ - 1♥-DBL- pass
2♣-pass or 2♥- 2♠*
1♣-1♥-DBL-pass
2♦-pass or 2♥ -2♠*
Just a question: how do you play
1♣- 1♥-DBL -pass
1♠
is that 3 cards and a min hand (2♠ being the same weak hand but with 4 spades) or does 1♠ guarantee 4 cards?
I would say if the 1♠ rebid to the take out dbl shows 3 cards, the 2♠ rebid simply does not exist as a natural bid.
#5
- Andy Bowles
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Posted 2011-May-26, 08:04
Where the overcaller passes on the second round, 2♠ is forcing with four good spades.
Where the overcaller bids 2♥ on the second round, 2♠ is competitive and non-forcing with four good spades. Even if opener could have bid 1♠ with three, that doesn't mean he's denied three spades by bidding something else.
Where the overcaller bids 2♥ on the second round, 2♠ is competitive and non-forcing with four good spades. Even if opener could have bid 1♠ with three, that doesn't mean he's denied three spades by bidding something else.
... that would still not be conclusive proof, before someone wants to explain that to me as well as if I was a 5 year-old. - gwnn
#6
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Posted 2011-May-27, 04:37
whereagles, on 2011-May-26, 06:59, said:
Just a question: how do you play
1♣- 1♥-DBL -pass
1♠
is that 3 cards and a min hand (2♠ being the same weak hand but with 4 spades) or does 1♠ guarantee 4 cards?
I would say if the 1♠ rebid to the take out dbl shows 3 cards, the 2♠ rebid simply does not exist as a natural bid.
1♣- 1♥-DBL -pass
1♠
is that 3 cards and a min hand (2♠ being the same weak hand but with 4 spades) or does 1♠ guarantee 4 cards?
I would say if the 1♠ rebid to the take out dbl shows 3 cards, the 2♠ rebid simply does not exist as a natural bid.
I play
1♣-1♥-DBL-pass
1♠= 3-4♠, minimum and balanced.
2♠=4♠, min and unbalanced (including 4225)
gnasher, on 2011-May-26, 08:04, said:
Even if opener could have bid 1♠ with three, that doesn't mean he's denied three spades by bidding something else.
I totally agree with that.
"Genius has its own limitations, however stupidity has no such boundaries!"
"It's only when a mosquito lands on your testicles that you realize there is always a way to solve problems without using violence!"
"Well to be perfectly honest, in my humble opinion, of course without offending anyone who thinks differently from my point of view, but also by looking into this matter in a different perspective and without being condemning of one's view's and by trying to make it objectified, and by considering each and every one's valid opinion, I honestly believe that I completely forgot what I was going to say."
"It's only when a mosquito lands on your testicles that you realize there is always a way to solve problems without using violence!"
"Well to be perfectly honest, in my humble opinion, of course without offending anyone who thinks differently from my point of view, but also by looking into this matter in a different perspective and without being condemning of one's view's and by trying to make it objectified, and by considering each and every one's valid opinion, I honestly believe that I completely forgot what I was going to say."
#7
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Posted 2011-May-29, 14:41
If a 1♠ rebid could be on 3 cards, 2♠ now is a bit strange. Still, if we abide by "all undiscussed bids are natural", then that should be like 4 good spades and like 9-10 hcp or so.
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