[jeffford76]

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Matchpoints, 2/1

Agree with 4C? Now what?

[mtvesuvius]

Agree with 4♣... I'd bid 5♣ now, even if partner is trying for slam, a likely problem is being off two cashing spades (or if partner is trying to show ♦ problems, then the ♦K is not well-placed). If partner is making a COG, then we'd prefer to play 5♣ as well... I think all roads point to 5♣, but perhaps I need a better imagination.

[Phil]

Thrump!

[kayin801]

Should be COG, but I'm afraid of losing 2 spades and an outside A or a spade, spade ruff, and something outside when playing 5♣. If partner is 4-4 in the majors with something like xxxx, AKQx, xx, Axx 4♥ is better, and I hope partner has a good 4 card suit and the club A at least for his bid, counting on our shortness in spades, else he might try 5♣ or some other slammish call. Heck, partner could have an 18-19 balanced hand too like KJxx, AKQx, Qx, Axx or QJxx, AKxx, Ax, Axx. Partner doesn't have to have 4 spades, but I don't think we're placed any worse as long as we have good hearts and running clubs.

Edit: agree with phil's thrump suggestion if we play X that way here.

[olien]

Thrump it

[Fluffy]

what is the meaning of thrump?

IMO this is a cuebid, I have diamond cuebid, but the bad one, and my hand is poor, I think 5♣ is the bid, some pairs play 4♠ last train cuebid, that would work here, but I don't so 5♣

[Phil]

Fluffy, on 2010-December-16, 15:09, said:

what is the meaning of thrump?

IMO this is a cuebid, I have diamond cuebid, but the bad one, and my hand is poor, I think 5♣ is the bid, some pairs play 4♠ last train cuebid, that would work here, but I don't so 5♣

Thrump's a double of 3♠ that wants pard to bid 3N with a spade stop. It doesn't say much about hearts like a typical negative double would.

[olien]

Over 4♥ though, I would go back to 5♣. ♥ rate to split poorly, and so I want to play the safer fit. If partner has 4♥, there's a fair chance of a 5-1 split, and I don't want to have to deal with that, and if partner is 6-5 or 6-4 (or 5-4), then I prefer to play our 12(11) card fit. Sure, if partner's hearts are AKQx, it may be better to play 4♥, but that seems like a pretty unlikely holding, and in my partnership style, my partners would tend to open 1♥ with that holding.

[Hanoi5]

5♣, but I wouldn't be sure if partner is cue-bidding or offering to play in a 4-3 fit (or maybe he has 5 hearts? Not likely).

[ewleongusa]

jeffford76, on 2010-December-16, 11:57, said:

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Matchpoints, 2/1

Agree with 4C? Now what?

Partner would certainly bid this way with: S xxx H AKx D A C AJ10xxx or S x H AKx D QJx C AJ10xxx.
So possibly passing partner in 4H when he could have less than four hearts is out.
I see little alternative then but to bid 5C.

Eric Leong

[OleBerg]

With a good enough partner; Pass.

Best game before slam-investigation.

[whereagles]

4♣ is fine. We seem to have found pard with the 18-19 balanced hand and that seems not to be enough for a slam (especially with no aces and two suits wide open), so a mere raise to 5 is sort of clear.

By the way, I don't buy it that pard wants to try for a new suit here. That might make sense, but not to me.

[nige1]

jeffford76, on 2010-December-16, 11:57, said:

Matchpoints, 2/1
Agree with 4C? Now what?

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• Over 3♠ I like Phil's Thrump idea. It's new to me
• Over 4♥, I would bid 5♣ like everybody else.

[jeffford76]

I held the 1C / 4H hand, 92 AK3 AQJ7 AJ65. At the table I thought 6C was in the picture and had the problem that I didn't know whether partner would take 4H as a cue, in which case I wanted to bid it hoping to hear 4S, or would take it to play in which case I wanted to bid 4S to make a try for slam. The problem with bidding 4S if partner thought 4H was a cue was that it would seem like I was looking for heart control, so partner wouldn't move even with spade control. (4D for us would have been ace asking.)

I was also hoping that even if it was misunderstood that partner would have a hand where passing was wrong. Or that she would use the same logic to decide that 5C was safer than pass in case I thought it was a cue. That said, I certainly don't blame partner for passing.

[nige1]

jeffford76, on 2010-December-22, 18:27, said:

I held the 1C / 4H hand, 92 AK3 AQJ7 AJ65. At the table I thought 6C was in the picture and had the problem that I didn't know whether partner would take 4H as a cue, in which case I wanted to bid it hoping to hear 4S, or would take it to play in which case I wanted to bid 4S to make a try for slam. The problem with bidding 4S if partner thought 4H was a cue was that it would seem like I was looking for heart control, so partner wouldn't move even with spade control. (4D for us would have been ace asking.) I was also hoping that even if it was misunderstood that partner would have a hand where passing was wrong. Or that she would use the same logic to decide that 5C was safer than pass in case I thought it was a cue. That said, I certainly don't blame partner for passing.

The voting here implies that partner should have got this right. A 4♦ cue-bid seems safer than jeffford's 4♥, however, because even if partner misinterprets it, he is unlikely to pass it.

[dake50]

After thrump double, isn't the bidding even more vexing?
Now 4H could be a new suit esp. as thrump didn't promise clubs source of tricks.

A&E have discussed this?
What are thrump follow-ups?
4H is suit? or Q?
4C forces Q's? 4D key-ask? 4M Q-bids? Natural suits?
Relay 4C if no stop and not 5+Clubs?

I'm hoping some "why's for your pair's follow-ups.

[whereagles]

jeffford76, on 2010-December-22, 18:27, said:

I held the 1C / 4H hand, 92 AK3 AQJ7 AJ65. At the table I thought 6C was in the picture (...)

How about some bluffing? Bid 4♠. Pard will wiggle a bit and bid 5♣, after which you continue your aggravation with FIVE spades. Then pass the likely 6♣ and see if they have the nerve to lead spades, HA!

[han]

Bad hand for playing kickback.