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Robson and Segal's structure

#21 User is offline   Free 

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Posted 2010-November-09, 03:40

View Poststraube, on 2010-November-08, 12:08, said:

What do optional doubles show?

Values without a clear bid, usually balanced without fit.
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#22 User is offline   phil_20686 

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Posted 2010-November-09, 04:47

View Postmgoetze, on 2010-November-08, 12:09, said:

Please do not misrepresent the teachings of the masters. :P
They advocate this treatment only for passed hands, and if you are passing that hand initially, you obviously have different frequencies than they do.


Passed hands, and always at 3 level or greater opposite an overcall I think, even if unpassed: e.g.

(1h) 1s (2h) 3c


At least that is how I remember it. Obviously I did not choose my example hand very well :)
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#23 User is offline   Ant590 

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Posted 2010-November-09, 09:58

View Postphil_20686, on 2010-November-09, 04:47, said:

Passed hands, and always at 3 level or greater opposite an overcall I think, even if unpassed: e.g.

(1h) 1s (2h) 3c


At least that is how I remember it. Obviously I did not choose my example hand very well :)


I think someone once told me that R/S contradict themselves in the book about this.

I personally like R/S. It is easy to grasp, and although there are probably better schemes it seems to make sense and is preferable to "everything natural" styles.
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#24 User is offline   straube 

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Posted 2010-November-10, 16:30

View Postphil_20686, on 2010-November-09, 04:47, said:

Passed hands, and always at 3 level or greater opposite an overcall I think, even if unpassed: e.g.

(1h) 1s (2h) 3c


At least that is how I remember it. Obviously I did not choose my example hand very well :)


You are right. Found it...

Quote

We mentioned the same sort of consideration when we were looking at FNJs in chapter 2. Do you recall such sequences as ...?

West North East South
1♠ 2♥ 2♠ ?

What were you to do if you held something like...?
♠ K64 ♥4 ♦ Q72 ♣ KQ10752

The answer is: wait. If it’s right for your side to do more bidding, then for sure partner will reopen. In this sequence you have no real option playing the methods we recommended, for 3♣ would be a FNJ.

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#25 User is offline   cloa513 

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Posted 2010-November-10, 18:40

View PostFree, on 2010-November-08, 09:32, said:

Yes, showing a 9th trumps is imo very important! Opener with a singleton knows he will be able to safely play a dummy reversal.
When we have a natural 2NT we Dbl (because of the limited openings we play optional doubles, not negative doubles). Even when playing a natural system, the natural 2NT is too rare to bother (and in this case we pass and hope partner doubles for takeout, so we can convert)

You can play dummy reversal with 3 trumps in dummy- they need to be very good trumps like at least 2 honours and a 9. 4 low trumps don't allow dummy reversal they still need to quite good.
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Posted 2010-November-11, 14:28

View Postcloa513, on 2010-November-10, 18:40, said:

You can play dummy reversal with 3 trumps in dummy- they need to be very good trumps like at least 2 honours and a 9. 4 low trumps don't allow dummy reversal they still need to quite good.

This comment is hilarious. No idea where you get this info, but it's completely wrong. I hope you were drinking or very tired when you wrote this. :P

For a dummy reversal in a 5-3 fit you don't need 2 very good trumps in the short hand, 1 is enough:
KQxxx vs Axx => you ruff 3 times => KQ vs Axx
If trumps are 3-2 you still don't lose a single trump trick. If they're 4-1 you'll lose one and possibly lose control.

When having a 5-4 fit you don't even need a single top honour in the 4-trump hand!
AKxxx vs xxxx => you ruff 3 times in dummy after playing trump AK, if trumps are 2-2 there's no problem, if trumps are 3-1 you still lose 1 trump trick. But you'll never lose control!
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#27 User is offline   mtvesuvius 

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Posted 2010-November-11, 14:30

View PostFree, on 2010-November-11, 14:28, said:

This comment is hilarious. No idea where you get this info, but it's completely wrong. I hope you were drinking or very tired when you wrote this. :P

No, actually, as far as I know, all his posts are like that.
Yay for the "Ignored Users" feature!
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