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Play 4S Daytona Hand #3

#1 User is offline   mtvesuvius 

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Posted 2010-November-04, 17:01

The lead is the Q, plan the play.
If you play a Heart now:
Spoiler


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#2 User is offline   mikeh 

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Posted 2010-November-04, 17:46

I think we need trump to be 3-2 (we can pick up some 4-1's but we have a lot of work left to do).

If we play on hearts, how are we planning to enjoy the 9? It's possible but it looks to me as if we need a fair amount of luck...3-3 hearts with one or both honours onside....roughly 25% or so, I think....or Hx onside with the long spade in that hand.

If we ignore hearts, we need to have the clubs sit well for us. Maybe win the diamond, ruff a diamond and lead a small club towards the Q. if LHO rises, we are in great shape...we'll pitch a heart on the diamond, draw two rounds of trump and play on clubs...we make on all 3-2 spade breaks whenever the club K is onside and they rise, unless clubs were 5-1, and even then we are ok since rho may be ruffing with the long trump.

If LHO ducks the club and the Q wins, take the heart pitch, play two rounds of trump and then play club A and a club...winning when clubs are 3-3 and whenever the long club lacks the 3rd spade.

In addition, if we think we can read LHO, we could play a spot when he plays low and then lead the Q back to squash his 10x or Jx....I doubt that I'd ever try that at the table unless I really knew that LHO was the kind who'd always give away the location of the club K.

I think that the club line is a little better than the heart line, tho I don't pretend to have calculated it at all. indeed since the club line depends in part on how LHO defends, it really isn't susceptible to ready calculation at all.
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#3 User is offline   gnasher 

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Posted 2010-November-04, 18:37

View Postmikeh, on 2010-November-04, 17:46, said:


Maybe win the diamond, ruff a diamond and lead a small club towards the Q ...

If LHO ducks the club and the Q wins, take the heart pitch, play two rounds of trump and then play club A and a club...winning when clubs are 3-3 and whenever the long club lacks the 3rd spade.

I think that if Q won I'd play a heart to the jack next. If I can make my 10 good, I can throw a club on the winning diamond.
... that would still not be conclusive proof, before someone wants to explain that to me as well as if I was a 5 year-old. - gwnn
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#4 User is offline   nige1 

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Posted 2010-November-04, 18:38

View Postmtvesuvius, on 2010-November-04, 17:01, said:

The lead is the Q
My guess: K, finesse J. Win return with A discarding a ,
  • On good day: finesse T, Cash A, AK, 9 discarding another . Claim: losing 1, 1, 1.
  • More often, a defender will ruff A, hopefully from a three-card trump-holding, Then if 9 is not good, you may need a favourable -position or end-play (e.g. K with LHO or doubleton with RHO).

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#5 User is offline   mikeh 

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Posted 2010-November-04, 18:44

View Postgnasher, on 2010-November-04, 18:37, said:

I think that if Q won I'd play a heart to the jack next. If I can make my 10 good, I can throw a club on the winning diamond.

yes, I like that....I was so focussed on the question of which suit to attack at trick 2 that I stopped thinking.
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#6 User is offline   rhm 

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Posted 2010-November-05, 03:55

For all practical purposes you can not make the hand unless trump break. So assume that.
I think you should combine the chances of the finesse with a favorable position in , which is not only being 3-3, but for example if East has a doubleton honor in with exactly 3 trumps. (Discarding a on the and playing for the king to be onside (50%) and a favorable club break (either to break or that you can ruff the fourth on the table) is already less likely to work than finding at least one honor onside (75%) and a favorable break. However, even if these two chances would be equally likely (which they are not), in the latter case you still have the finesse in reserve.

Accordingly win with a high play a , win the next in dummy, discarding a club and take another finesse.
Assuming it wins, but the king has not appeared yet, play next a to the queen.
West will not be able to give East a ruff and if East wins and can give West a ruff, there was never a realistic chance anyway.
However, if East wins and does not give West a ruff, will likely break and you get home now.
Should you change your play if East plays the king on the second round?
This may depend on how good a player East is. Against 99% of all player it is reasonable to assume East has 2 cards in , where playing on clubs now can not win.
Just play your remaining high from hand, and if it gets ruffed hope that it is from 3 trumps, which is now a better than even chance when trumps break.
Should East play a honor on the first round of similar considerations apply. You are in good shape though not home yet. Continuing is probably best.

Rainer Herrmann
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#7 User is offline   mtvesuvius 

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Posted 2010-November-07, 23:30

At the table, I took Nigel's line, and was fortunate to make, however I think Mike's line is much better in theory :)

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