[Hanoi5]

When mixed pairs are played men and women sit in a fixed position. I thought that position was North and East for men and South and West for women. I heard someone tell me that in Philadelphia men sat North and West, probably 'cause it looks better with screens (there's a man and a woman on each side). So, what's correct? Does it matter?

And of course I've always wondered (or maybe I just want to see women fighting here), why is this done? why can't men and women sit wherever they like?

[gwnn]

I heard the idea was not to let the two men talk bad about their partners. Don't take this the wrong way - this is just what I heard.

Anyway, I think letting men and women sit in a fixed position is quite sexist and I have not heard any decent arguments to convince me otherwise (besides maybe symmetry and order or something).

[gnasher]

Suppose that women tend to eat more salads than men. Suppose further that there is a deal that particularly rewards an East who eats a lot of salads.

If the players are allowed to sit wherever they want to, a pair that happens have their female player sitting East will tend to do better on this particular deal than a pair that doesn't. This increases the variance of the results.


For "eat a lot of salads" above, substitute whatever relevant differences you believe tend to exist betweeen men and women. If you don't believe that such differences exist, you probably have better things to do with your time that play in a mixed pairs.

[gordontd]

I don't recall us having such regulations here, when we have such events, do we Andy?

[TimG]

gwnn, on 2010-October-29, 05:04, said:

Anyway, I think letting men and women sit in a fixed position is quite sexist and I have not heard any decent arguments to convince me otherwise (besides maybe symmetry and order or something).

Assigned seating is sexist, but a mixed event is not?

[gwnn]

Good catch but I guess it could be interpreted as in the spirit of Affirmative Action.

[gnasher]

gordontd, on 2010-October-29, 05:31, said:

I don't recall us having such regulations here, when we have such events, do we Andy?

I don't think so, though I'm not a frequent participant in EBU mixed pairs events.

I'm not sure how that's relevant, though. Is there any particular reason for the WBF to follow the EBU's lead in this matter?

[gordontd]

gnasher, on 2010-October-29, 06:33, said:

I don't think so, though I'm not a frequent participant in EBU mixed pairs events.

I'm not sure how that's relevant, though. Is there any particular reason for the WBF to follow the EBU's lead in this matter?

The initial post started "When mixed pairs are played men and women sit in a fixed position." The statement was not limited to the WBF or any other body.

[gnasher]

gordontd, on 2010-October-29, 06:45, said:

The initial post started "When mixed pairs are played men and women sit in a fixed position." The statement was not limited to the WBF or any other body.

Oh I see. You were unsure about the current EBU practice in this respect, and thought I might know. In a better world, it would be possible to google

site:www.ebu.co.uk "portland pairs" reguations

and get a definitive answer to this question.

[hotShot]

I was told that in a Mixed, the gentleman should do the administration.
This requires sitting north to write down the results and sitting east to check what north is writing.

But the age of gentlemen is over ......

[gordontd]

gnasher, on 2010-October-29, 07:09, said:

Oh I see. You were unsure about the current EBU practice in this respect, and thought I might know. In a better world, it would be possible to google

site:www.ebu.co.uk "portland pairs" reguations

and get a definitive answer to this question.

It was really just meant to be a friendly exchange, since you quite frequently play in a mixed partnership and you play all over the world. I'm sorry to have imposed.

[gnasher]

gordontd, on 2010-October-29, 07:32, said:

It was really just meant to be a friendly exchange, since you quite frequently play in a mixed partnership and you play all over the world. I'm sorry to have imposed.

I seem to have caused the sort of misunderstanding that normally only occurs between people from different continents.

I wasn't suggesting that you should stop bothering me and go and look it up for yourself. I meant that I didn't know, had tried to find the relevant information on the EBU's website, and had been unsuccessful.

But having reread what I wrote, I can see that it didn't read like that - sorry.

[kfay]

I'm watching the Italian Mixed Teams on Vugraph at the moment and, even though I know most of the players, it's nice to know that South and East are women when you can't tell just by looking at their last names. That way you don't look stupid when talking with your friends and especially when commentating on vugraph.

[Gerben42]

In the WBF events, women are seated South and East because then each screen side is mixed. I think that's quite nice, although the women get all the fun and meet the bigger stars. Also it ensures a better atmosphere when the two men are not on the same side of the screen

[matmat]

women sit south and east because they have sunnier dispositions.

[Elianna]

This forced seating arrangement also wasn't a requirement at ACBL mixed pairs that I've played in.

[barmar]

The existence of events with gender restrictions presupposes a difference between the sexes. Fixed seating is consistent with this notion, leveling the playing field by having the players in the same category competing with each other.

It's done similarly in pro-am events, where all the pros sit in the same seats.

[Oof Arted]

Gordon really our Assistant CTD doesnt know the Answer Tut Tut


TIC

[ggwhiz]

I seem to remember that Lynn Deas and Juanita Chambers used to sit north in these events as a distinct advantage with them in the "mans" seat. Since they played like Andre the Giant and their partners were usually up to playing like Hulk Hogan, it worked too.

[jallerton]

In EBL (European) and WBF events there are fixed seats in the mixed pairs (done as suggested to have a man & woman on each side of the screen), and in the mixed teams which also requires two mixed pairs.

In EBU mixed pairs events there is no restriction on where you sit; and the EBU mixed teams event is a pivot teams where you only need to have at least one person of each gender on your team.

The logic behind the fixed seating arrangements sort of makes sense for the reasons Gnasher suggested, except that in the EBL & WBF events there are quite a lot of client-pro pairs with a pro woman, which somewhat changes the balance.