[kgr]

Scoring: IMP

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1♣-(2♥)-Pass-(3♥)
??..
1♣=2+ (open 5542)
2♥=weak; 3♥=preemptive
 
- What do you call now?
- I did bid 4♣ and partner did bid 4♦ over it. Is that natural or control for ♣? What do you bid now?

[kgr]

The complete bidding:
1♣-(2♥)-Pass-(3♥)
4♣-(Pass)-4♦-(Pass)
4♥-(Pass)-5♦-AP
 
I explained, behind screens, that 4♦ was a control but that I wasn't 100% sure.
Partner did bid 5♦ and I couldn't imagine that she had a grand invite so I passed.
...Would you have taken 4♦ as natural?

[P_Marlowe]

Hi,

#1 4C looks reasonable, they have a fit, you have nothing in their suit,
your suit is not brilliant, but it could be worse
#2 4D is certainly a cue for clubs, if p has nothing, he should shut up,
if he has diamonds, he should have tried to introduce them earlier.
The only question is, if one goes so far as to assume, that p has a trap pass
for hearts, I am not 100% sure, this will also depend on your agreements
for neg. X on the 2 level.
#3 Over 4NT I will bid 4NT, RKCB for clubs, even the Ace of hearts will be useful.

With kind regards
Marlowe

[rhm]

If a bid in an undiscussed sequence can be natural it should be taken as such.

Over 1♣-(2♥), 3♦ from partner creates a game force.
I see no good reason why partner can not have long ♦, but not enough for a game force.
On the other hand if parter wants to play ♣, if worse come to worse he may have to choose between 5♣ and 6♣, but can often hedge with 4♥.
If he thinks ♦ should be trumps he has no choice.

Accordingly I would bid 4♥. Over 5♦ I would bid 6♦, but I can understand pass.
I just don't think partner would fight my ♣, if he is very weak.

Rainer Herrmann

[P_Marlowe]

kgr, on Sep 27 2010, 06:14 AM, said:

The complete bidding:
1♣-(2♥)-Pass-(3♥)
4♣-(Pass)-4♦-(Pass)
4♥-(Pass)-5♦-AP
 
I explained, behind screens, that 4♦ was a control but that I wasn't 100% sure.
Partner did bid 5♦ and I couldn't imagine that she had a grand invite so I passed.
...Would you have taken 4♦ as natural?

A grand invite without knowing, that there are no spade loosers?

With kind regards
Marlowe

[gwnn]

Firstly: 4♦ is natural, partner can't have a slam try for clubs (having passed over 2♥), but he might have long diamonds and a weak hand.

Secondly: 4♦ is non-forcing but you have a nice hand for diamonds so your 4♥ bid is fine (showing a good raise in diamonds)

Thirdly: I think 4♣ was an underbid; double first, then pull to 4♣. If partner passes your double, fine, if he bids 4♠ over 4♣, fine. He should have 5 if he bids 4♠ over the double since with a good hand with 4 spades, he'd have acted over 2♥.

Finally: the past tense of the verb 'to bid' is 'bid', you can just say e.g. 'I bid 4♣' just like you said 'I explained' instead of 'I did explain'.

[P_Marlowe]

gwnn, on Sep 27 2010, 07:13 AM, said:

Firstly: 4♦ is natural, partner can't have a slam try for clubs (having passed over 2♥), but he might have long diamonds and a weak hand.

Secondly: 4♦ is non-forcing but you have a nice hand for diamonds so your 4♥ bid is fine (showing a good raise in diamonds)

Thirdly: I think 4♣ was an underbid; double first, then pull to 4♣. If partner passes your double, fine, if he bids 4♠ over 4♣, fine. He should have 5 if he bids 4♠ over the double since with a good hand with 4 spades, he'd have acted over 2♥.

Finally: the past tense of the verb 'to bid' is 'bid', you can just say e.g. 'I bid 4♣' just like you said 'I explained' instead of 'I did explain'.

Firstly - p may not have known, that we have a club fit, in case he happens
to look at AQ in clubs only (*) and he may in addidition just been looking
at a good 5 card heart suit.
(*) Even a single top honor would be enough to allow him to assume, that
we have a fit, opener does not introduce a lousy 6 card suit on the 4 level,
if it is broken, it will a 7 carder.
Secondly - introducing a new suit in a nonforcing manner to play 4D instead
of 4C is a good way to earn money, besides they may strat going for
blood.
And even on frequency - the frequence, that we have club support
instead of a long diamond suit with reasonbale suit quality, the suit has to
be a 7 carder and needs be headed ta least by KJ, is ... higher.
Playing with a regular p, I would always assume, that he sees this that
way, this a matter of "My way or, thanks, it was a pleasure, but you will
find the way to the next high way by yourself."

Of course I happen to play methods, that would have allowed responder to
introduce a diamond single suiter directly over 2H, as long as we are talking
about constructive values, but the above would hold, even if I had no such
methods, sometimes it is better to give up before they start going for blood.

With kind regards
Marlowe

[kgr]

gwnn, on Sep 27 2010, 02:13 PM, said:

Thirdly: I think 4♣ was an underbid; double first, then pull to 4♣. If partner passes your double, fine, if he bids 4♠ over 4♣, fine. He should have 5 if he bids 4♠ over the double since with a good hand with 4 spades, he'd have acted over 2♥.

I don't like to DBL with a void and a 7 card. And can I be much weaker when I bid 4♣ opposite a passed partner.
...Not sure that DBL is better, maybe

[cloa513]

"I called" and "had bid" is better.

[Free]

I'd Dbl instead of 4♣.

Ok, your auction. 4♦ for me is natural. With a strong hand he should just bid 4♥ now, you'll probably have a ♦ control anyway. What to do now? Pfff I guess 5♦ but not happy with it.

[Fluffy]

I'd also double rather than 4♣, give yourself a chance to 4♠.

after 4♦ depends on partner, if partner might bid 4♦ with 6♦s and void in clubs to "rescue" me, then I'd pass 5♦, but if he is sane partner I like my chances in 6♦, ♦K6 with the club singleton should be enough to make

[kgr]

Partner had a ♣ void.
I think his hand was something like:
♠xxx
♥Axxx
♦QTxxxx
♣