[cnszsun]

Scoring: IMP

1♥-1♠
??

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[Little Kid]

2♠, what else?

[Codo]

My gut feeling was 3 ♠ and I thought that partner needs not much to make game.
But if I try 3 ♠, I will reach a lot of bad games, so I would try 2 ♠ too.

[ArtK78]

2 1/2♠.

But, since this is not allowed, I will settle for 2♠.

Better to have something in reserve, especially playing with a partner who will stretch to bid game (as everyone does).

[pooltuna]

Little Kid, on Aug 23 2010, 07:39 AM, said:

2♠, what else?

What else?! You left off WTP!

[shyams]

At IMPs, I'd bid 3♠ with this hand.

If I had the problem at MPs, my instinct would be still to jump to 3. But I'd probably choose the more normal looking 2♠

[jdonn]

Not 3♠!!

[rogerclee]

I just want to add this is another problem with not playing Flannery, the range of 1H P 1S P 2S is truly ridiculous. It shows anything from a 35(32) 11 count with major suit concentration to a 45(31) 13 count.

[bluecalm]

2♠.
Imo one should avoid stretching when inviting at all costs.
Playing 3♠ instead of 2♠ is sizeable loss even without taking into account many too thin games which will be reach after 3♠.

[fromageGB]

rogerclee, on Aug 23 2010, 04:20 PM, said:

I just want to add this is another problem with not playing Flannery, the range of 1H P 1S P 2S is truly ridiculous. It shows anything from a 35(32) 11 count with major suit concentration to a 45(31) 13 count.

Why not play Kaplan inversion, as it solves the problem. Then a 1♠ response cannot be more than 4 cards, so the opener with 3 spades can happily rebid 1NT.

Incidentally, I think your quoted range could be extended upwards. A 15 count 4522 ?

[mikegill]

Agree this huge range is a big problem. My favorite solution to this, among other things, is to play:

1♥ - 1♠ -
1N = ♦, almost forcing
2♣ = normal
2♦ = 3-card spade raise

With 5332 you have to either raise spades if you have 3 or fake a minor. It's almost always right to raise spades on 3 since you have at worst 4-3 fit with shortness in the 3 and responder can offer the 5-2 if he has a doubleton heart.

This solves:
1) This problem, since 2♠ now shows 4.
2) Many of the bridge-world-hand-of-doom scenarios where you have 3-6 majors since you can bid 2♦ then bid again.
3) 1♥ - 1♠ - 2♦ - 3♣ is now 1♥ - 1♠ - 1N - 2♣
4) You also hide opener's minor shape when he's 35xx and responder has a min GF (esp if playing precision)

at the expense of not being able to play 1NT, but honestly I can't even remember the last time that 1NT was the last making contract after 1♥ - 1♠.

[aguahombre]

mikegill, on Aug 23 2010, 12:10 PM, said:

....at the expense of not being able to play 1NT, but honestly I can't even remember the last time that 1NT was the last making contract after 1♥ - 1♠.

What about the "best" making contract?

[mikegill]

Quote

What about the "best" making contract?

Yes sometimes at matchpoints 1N will make the same tricks as 2M. Usually you're playing 2M instead, not a minor, so I've found it's usually a wash - sometimes 2M will make an extra trick. Even if it's a small loss I think it's probably worth it. A lot of people will raise to 2♠ on 3 decent spades most of the time anyway, so you're certainly duplicating their results. Yes if you pick up xxx Qxxxx AJT AQ with these methods you'll be unhappy with bidding 2♦, but sometimes partner has 5 spades and you win by playing your 8-card fit instead of 1N.

[Fluffy]

rogerclee, on Aug 23 2010, 03:20 PM, said:

I just want to add this is another problem with not playing Flannery, the range of 1H P 1S P 2S is truly ridiculous. It shows anything from a 35(32) 11 count with major suit concentration to a 45(31) 13 count.

try raising with support only, and you will see it differently lol.

[lmilne]

ITT: Flannery fanboys!

[neilkaz]

2♠ I don't have to have a minimum every time !

[aguahombre]

rogerclee, on Aug 23 2010, 09:20 AM, said:

I just want to add this is another problem with not playing Flannery, the range of 1H P 1S P 2S is truly ridiculous. It shows anything from a 35(32) 11 count with major suit concentration to a 45(31) 13 count.

I just want to add this is another problem with playing Flannery; the range of 1H P 1S P 2S is truly ridiculous. It shows anything from a 35(32) 11 count without regard to major suit concentration to a 46(21) 13 count.

[bluecalm]

Quote

I just want to add this is another problem with not playing Flannery, the range of 1H P 1S P 2S is truly ridiculous. It shows anything from a 35(32) 11 count with major suit concentration to a 45(31) 13 count.

Americans...
What is ridiculous is that it can be 3-5(3-2). Just bid 1NT wit that, you will find 5-3 fit anyway, wtp ?
Even if you are into business of raising with 3 card support, the problem hand is 3-5-(4-1) not 3-5-3-2.
I think most 14's counts with 4♠ should bid only 2♠ btw. You will just wind up too high too often if you jump around with too weak hands.

The solution to his seems to be really easy:

2♠ = 12-14, four spades
3♠ = 14+ - 16
Some sort of gadget with 17+ (gazilli).
If you refuse to play gadgets then 2♠ is basically 12-14; 3♠ 15-17 and with 18+ you bid game.

[Foxx]

4♣.

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Well, how else do you plan to bid the cold slam when partner has ♠K9xxx ♥10x ♦AQx ♣Axx?

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Seriously, 2♠ just like the rest of the sane world.

[Free]

Foxx, on Aug 25 2010, 02:03 AM, said:

how else do you plan to bid the cold slam when partner has ♠K9xxx ♥10x ♦AQx ♣Axx?

1♥ - 1♠
2♠ - 2NT (relay)
4♣ - ...

Seriously