[Fluffy]

1♣-1♦
1NT-2♠
3♣-3♦
3NT-4♦
5♣-5♦
pass

---

620 was outscored by 920 660 and even a couple 640 for 23%. Who's to blame?

[billw55]

West signed off about as many times as humanly possible. Why did east decide to try 4♦ at matchpoints?

That said, I prefer a 2♣ rebid for west.

[rbforster]

billw55, on May 14 2010, 08:46 AM, said:

West signed off about as many times as humanly possible.  Why did east decide to try 4♦ at matchpoints?

That said, I prefer a 2♣ rebid for west.

Agree on both accounts. When West bids 3N over 3♦ showing a clear heart stopper, East without extras and with poor diamonds (and only 1 more than the 4-6 he showed) should happily pass with his help in hearts. While I think 2♣ is a better rebid, West's limiting his hand to 12-14 with 1N makes East's continued bidding more clearly wrong.

[MFA]

At matchpoints I would also give up after 3NT since this scenario where we end up in 5♦ is intolerable.

I would have tried 6♦ over 5♣.
I would also have rebid 2♣ instead of 1NT.

As much as 23% for 5♦+1 is a miracle.

[TylerE]

On this hand once you decide to go past 3N you might as well bid 6♦, as any other contract is bound to have very poor matchpoint equity.

[MFA]

TylerE, on May 14 2010, 04:18 PM, said:

On this hand once you decide to go past 3N you might as well bid 6♦, as any other contract is bound to have very poor matchpoint equity.

If partner has ♥K instead of ♦K he could bid 4NT (... 3NT-4mi-4NT should always be natural in these situations). That will be ok hopefully.

[andy_h]

East, for not subsiding in 3NT as the auction dictates that most of partner's values are in hearts and clubs. Imagine ♥KJ ♣AQJ and there's not much space left for the suits that East is interested in. Isn't a typical West hand some form of 3325? That makes slam even harder especially the spade situation and if West doesn't have the ♦K and they lead a club, there's hardly time to unblock hearts.

I'm also in the 2♣ camp with West's cards. Even at matchpoints, 1NT is going a little far for me, what's wrong with a really good club suit to show that we may never be able to do so if we don't bid it now?

[helene_t]

MFA, on May 14 2010, 03:07 PM, said:

As much as 23% for 5♦+1 is a miracle.

Must have been +2 if I understand the OP correctly.

[billw55]

helene_t, on May 14 2010, 10:07 AM, said:

MFA, on May 14 2010, 03:07 PM, said:

As much as 23% for 5♦+1 is a miracle.

Must have been +2 if I understand the OP correctly.

From the OP:

Quote

620 was outscored by 920 660 and even a couple 640 for 23%. Who's to blame?

The syntax is not 100% clear but I think the "for 23%" applies back to the 620, which would be 5m+1.

The greater question is how 920 and 620 are scoring on the same board ...

[Fluffy]

yeah 1370 lol, and even a 1390 was theere, 13 tricks are avaible witjh some guess or some missdefence.

[Hanoi5]

50%-50%. West misbid his/her hand by not rebidding the 6-card suit earlier, and not raising 5♦ and East kinda showed a weaker hand than s/he by bidding 5♦ only (although the suit quality might be to blame...).

[MarkDean]

I would have rebid 2♣ with west, I am not opposed to a 1NT rebid with 6 clubs, but with that strong of a suit, I do not like it. I agree with West's bidding after that. I think that East can bid 6♦ after 5♣ especially at MPs. That being said, 6♦ is not laydown or anything, perhaps 3/4NT is the best place to be (although that could go down on a bad day too).

I am jealous that you think 23% is a bottom...look at a few of my scores and a 23% won't seem that bad.

[jdonn]

I don't like most of what west did. Firstly I would open 1NT which would have made it very easy to reach 6♦. But far worse is his last two bids, when was he ever going to feel like supporting diamonds? For example over 3♦ west should have bid 4♦, then 4♥ by east and you are on your way.

Edit: I miscounted as 14 so I wouldn't open 1NT after all.

[Fluffy]

how many of you think 5♣ is a forward move towards 6♦?

[MarkDean]

Fluffy, on May 15 2010, 07:26 AM, said:

how many of you think 5♣ is a forward move towards 6♦?

I thought it was.

[bluecalm]

Quote

how many of you think 5♣ is a forward move towards 6♦?

4♦ = slam try in ♦.

After that : 4NT = bad hand for ♦ slam, signoff; 4♥/4♠/5♣ = cuebids, forward going.

This is how we play those situations.
I think the blame is with E. He has easy 6♦ after 5♣ bid, especially at MP's. For all W knows we may be missing ♥ control (AKxx xx AQxxxx K).

I guess it's system choice but I don't like hiding 6card suits in 2nd round of bidding.

[dellache]

I'd blame the pair : if you cannot stop in 4NT after 4♦, you don't want to languish in 5♦ at pairs. 5♦ making is not going to score much in average. Somebody has got to bid a probably bad 6♦ (West or East or both ) to save the board.