[bd71]

Scoring: MP

Playing 2/1 with first-time partner in typical club game.
Had no discussion on opening style (i.e. how often with 12, do we use Rule of 20, etc.).


1H-(P) to you

Is this worth a 2/1 bid?

If no, does your answer change at IMPS?

---

[jjbrr]

I would 2/1 but I admit this is about the weakest. The AJ of ♥ are fine and the JT of ♣ are ok.

If I'm in the minority, I wouldnt be surprised.

[billw55]

Forcing 1NT for me, followed by an invite. If partner passes that I doubt we are missing much.

[bb79]

i think it is borderline,
probably i won't stop below game though, and 1nt may wrong side possible 3NT, e.g. in case partner has Kx of spades (try kx kqxxx qxx kxx), so I will choose 2c.

[quiddity]

I think at mp, I'd just bid 1N/2N. Partner might be opening an 11-count here, and we're not getting any odds by playing in game. Plus the 2/1 will tend to mislead partner about the length/strength of the minor, and perhaps cause some misevaluation (maybe partner has a club stiff).

Vul at imps I'd force to game. Still tempted to bid 1N/3N instead of 2C.

[helene_t]

Agree with quiddity

[gwnn]

man up, this is a good 12, you dont win by finding all the optimal 2NT contracts

[655321]

I wouldn't bid 1NT with this hand unless I had previously agreed with partner that 1NT could include this sort of hand.

[rogerclee]

We have a mediocre 12 count and no fit and partner opened 1M at w/w MP. I would not force to game opposite any partner who describes his opening style as "I open almost all 5332 hands with a 5 card major and 12 points", which is basically everyone at this vul/scoring.

[jdonn]

655321, on Apr 23 2010, 05:01 PM, said:

I wouldn't bid 1NT with this hand unless I had previously agreed with partner that 1NT could include this sort of hand.

I'm not sure what you mean. The question is whether this particular hand is a balanced invitation, which is the "sort of hand" that everyone who plays 1NT forcing knows can be in 1NT. Personally I bid 1NT but it's close.

[rogerclee]

quiddity, on Apr 23 2010, 02:29 PM, said:

Vul at imps I'd force to game.  Still tempted to bid 1N/3N instead of 2C.

If you force to game 2C is the better bid IMO. You are just giving up equity on hands where you have to find out which game to play. For example let's say partner has x KQxxx KQxx Axx; you will diagnose the problem in spades if you start with 2C. If you start with 1N, 1N/3N will do very poorly.

(You can/should still get to 4H (1H-1N; 2D-2S; 3C-3H; 4H-P) but I think most B/I partnerships are not up to having this sequence.)

[rbforster]

quiddity, on Apr 23 2010, 04:29 PM, said:

Plus the 2/1 will tend to mislead partner about the length/strength of the minor, and perhaps cause some misevaluation (maybe partner has a club stiff).

So 2D then instead of 2C, assuming partner opens reasonably soundly? In NT, I want them to lead clubs rather than diamonds too. (and with so few agreements on 2/1, surely 2D only promises 4 with 3343 for example.

[bd71]

OK, 2nd part of the question...

Bidding goes 1H-1N-2H. Now what do you bid?

[mike777]

bd71, on Apr 23 2010, 10:31 PM, said:

OK, 2nd part of the question...

Bidding goes 1H-1N-2H.  Now what do you bid?

3h easy

fwiw in my style....



it shows this hand.
--------------

given OP.....with a first time pard i would have been in game long ago.

[rogerclee]

bd71, on Apr 23 2010, 08:31 PM, said:

OK, 2nd part of the question...

Bidding goes 1H-1N-2H. Now what do you bid?

2S

[MarkDean]

rogerclee, on Apr 23 2010, 08:52 PM, said:

bd71, on Apr 23 2010, 08:31 PM, said:

OK, 2nd part of the question...

Bidding goes 1H-1N-2H.  Now what do you bid?

2S

I thought that showed the minors?

[aguahombre]

I really like 2S, but for b/I i think 3H is about right. And for this forum, I think 1NT the first time is a good solid start.

[kenrexford]

Weird.

Part I: How is this a GF hand? Is your partner a Roth or a Stone, or a real human being?

Part IB: What the heck was that bit of discussion about balanced hands not being part of a 1NT response?

Part II: 3♥ with a pickup partner seems fairly obvious. He has six hearts, I have two hearts, that makes a fit. I have an invitational hand, so I invite.

[mike777]

kenrexford, on Apr 23 2010, 11:39 PM, said:

Weird. 

Part I: How is this a GF hand?  Is your partner a Roth or a Stone, or a real human being?

vite.

sigh roth and stone real humans....please.....

[rogerclee]

MarkDean, on Apr 23 2010, 08:54 PM, said:

rogerclee, on Apr 23 2010, 08:52 PM, said:

bd71, on Apr 23 2010, 08:31 PM, said:

OK, 2nd part of the question...

Bidding goes 1H-1N-2H.  Now what do you bid?

2S

I thought that showed the minors?

I guess it's an agreement thing but personally I have never thought 2S = minors (I know people play this) to be nearly as effective as either

1) strong heart raise that allows us to probe for 3N
2) forces 2N to show one of several handtypes