[bid_em_up]

MinorKid, on Mar 18 2010, 10:44 PM, said:

So ... after splinter how do you go to 7♦ if you want to?

You do not want to be in seven of anything on these holdings.

[cherdanno]

MinorKid, on Mar 18 2010, 10:44 PM, said:

So ... after splinter how do you go to 7♦ if you want to?
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I emailed my partner today about that. He said if he bid a direct 4♦ that is a honor (fitting) bid for slam. (Did you heard of that convension?) His reason is that we would never play 3NT after a splinter so we would use 3NT bid as a control cue bid request, while a immediate "cue-bid" shows honors in the suit.

Over 3♠, any side suit bid is a cuebid, showing A, K, singleton or void in the suit. However, it is a very good idea not to cuebid with shortness in partner's suit, only with A or K. So your partner is right.
In other words, just because you found one fit (hearts) does not mean you can't find another fit (in diamonds) later.
However, again I think it is very unlikely that you will need to play this hand in diamonds.

[MinorKid]

cherdanno, on Mar 19 2010, 06:27 PM, said:

MinorKid, on Mar 18 2010, 10:44 PM, said:

So ... after splinter how do you go to 7♦ if you want to?
------------------------------------------------------------------------
I emailed my partner today about that. He said if he bid a direct 4♦ that is a honor (fitting) bid for slam. (Did you heard of that convension?) His reason is that we would never play 3NT after a splinter so we would use 3NT bid as a control cue bid request, while a immediate "cue-bid" shows honors in the suit.

Over 3♠, any side suit bid is a cuebid, showing A, K, singleton or void in the suit. However, it is a very good idea not to cuebid with shortness in partner's suit, only with A or K. So your partner is right.
In other words, just because you found one fit (hearts) does not mean you can't find another fit (in diamonds) later.
However, again I think it is very unlikely that you will need to play this hand in diamonds.

Perhaps a direct 4♦ shows more than ♦Kxx while 4♦ via 3NT can be somthing like ♦K or ♦Kx.
For a suit that had not been bid it has to be at least five card suit with honors that needs a fit. Just like those required for a fit jump. i.e. like KJxxx AQxxx AKxxx...

[MinorKid]

OK now i tell all of you the result.

Scoring: IMP

N/S trick expectation
C 9
D 13
H 12
S 6
N 11~12

---

First of all if you splinter you will mostly go to 6♥ and make it. If you use the "honor fitting" cue bid i introduced after splinter you may also make 7♦ if you hold your captaincity.

Secondly, i had a firm agreement with my partner that a jump to a suit after an overcall is a fit jump and should tell more information than heart support (i.e. diamonds are important too.) all in one bid. It works too!

Finally the 7NT guys makes when west discarded a heart after 6 rounds of ♦ and 2 rounds of ♠.

[manudude03]

I won't comment on the agreement of 3♦ promising a fit. All I'll say is that it is almost certainly the case that if you employ 1 treatment to show 1 hand, you lose the ability to show another. Just take another hand posted here (by ArtK78) xxx x AKQJxx AQx, this would now be near impossible to show.

FWIW, the actual hand is a good grand, but not a great one. 7♦ is only a little better than 7♥ (sobeit on this hand 7♦ makes and not 7♥).

Edit: example hand removed, nonsense.

[MinorKid]

xxx x AKQJxx AQx
"Bid ♦ 3 times."

xxx xx AKQJx AKQ
Rebid ♦ ... hope for the best

EDITED:
xx x AJTxxxx AQx
Rebid ♦ ... see if partner raise

If i dont "raise", "splinter", "fit jump" or give any support showing bid,
partner should immediate know we have a misfit in that suit.
Afterall "support with support" is in first priority for contested auctions.

Perhaps one is right to not to play fit jump here, i had opened 1♦.
But there's no reason that you cannot hold 1-4-4-4 without any ♦ honors.

[ArtK78]

MinorKid, on Mar 20 2010, 08:01 PM, said:

xxx x AKQJxx AQx
"Bid ♦ 3 times."

xxx xx AKQJx AQx
Rebid ♦ ...

If i dont "raise", "splinter", "fit jump" or give any support showing bid,
partner should immediate know we have a misfit.
Afterall "support with support" is in first priority for contested auctions.

Perhaps one is right to not to play fit jump here, i had opened 1♦.
But there's no reason that you cannot hold 1-4-4-4 without any ♦ honors.

If you would bid diamonds 3 times with xxx x AKQJxx AQx, what would you do with xx x AJTxxxx AQx? These are certainly drastically different hands.

[MinorKid]

If opponent overcall which makes this impossible, let them off.