[crazy4hoop]

♠AQxx
♥J
♦AKQJ109x
♣x

You are the dealer, vul vs. not:
YOU
1♦-(Pass)-1NT-(2♥)-
3♥-(Dbl)-3NT-(Pass)-
???

Scoring is matchpoints. I am not really concerned if you like your bidding so far but I am interested if you would take any action here. Does the form of scoring make a difference?

[PhantomSac]

I would pass, form of scoring doesn't matter but it's really obvious at MP I think.

[Fluffy]

we got to where we wanted.

[aguahombre]

Fluffy, on Feb 24 2010, 07:20 PM, said:

we got to where we wanted.

Might go slamming if pard does NOT have a heart stop, though. Not sure how, but it would be fun.

[MarkDean]

Slam could be good, but partner needs pretty specific hands. I would pass.

[cherdanno]

aguahombre, on Feb 24 2010, 11:01 PM, said:

Fluffy, on Feb 24 2010, 07:20 PM, said:

we got to where we wanted.

Might go slamming if pard does NOT have a heart stop, though. Not sure how, but it would be fun.

Yup, that's why we bid 3♥.

[the hog]

I would bid 4D and I do not like the bidding to date. I would have bid 2S over 2H. It would be most amusing if they can run 5C or 4C and a H against a cold 5D.

[jdonn]

I don't think I'd pass. The combination that we have slam or that 3NT goes down seem enough to justify bidding on to me.

Part of what influences me is even if we have slam we may not need to bid it to score well, sometimes diamonds is just better than notrump. For example if partner has x AJT xxx KTxxxx then 5♦ making 6 beats 3NT making 3. Or we could be on a spade finesse for the 10th trick in notrump (and thus can't risk it) but the 12th trick in diamonds, like if you get a heart lead and partner has xx AJx 8xx Qxxxx.

Yes I know partner doesn't always have 3 diamonds for me, or an ace, but I am just trying to make a specific point. Plus we don't need those to be the case for diamonds to be right anyway. KJx QT9 xx QTxxx?

Last comment, I like the 3♥ bid. Why do I want to give partner the chance to pass a spade bid, knowing he doesn't have a fit, when I'm sure I want to play in diamonds (or notrump, but definitely not spades!)

[the hog]

"Why do I want to give partner the chance to pass a spade bid"?
If she passes a forcing bid its time to get a new partner.

[straube]

jdonn said:

Last comment, I like the 3♥ bid. Why do I want to give partner the chance to pass a spade bid, knowing he doesn't have a fit, when I'm sure I want to play in diamonds (or notrump, but definitely not spades!)

2S is forcing. It has the value of giving partner a picture of opener's hand. This might help him decide between NT and a diamond contract. For instance, if partner has Kxx Ax xxxx xxxx one can make 6 diamonds, but 3N may go down on a club lead. OTOH, 3H communicates a running diamond suit and as this may be my only chance to bid 3H, I'll do so now.

[jdonn]

Lol my bad I was thinking in terms of partner having passed on the last round.

[pooltuna]

PhantomSac, on Feb 24 2010, 08:56 PM, said:

I would pass, form of scoring doesn't matter but it's really obvious at MP I think.

This gets my vote. Those who bid 5♦ deserve the score they earn (which is not the same as their average result)

[crazy4hoop]

Thank you all for your input. BTW, I left out the fun part (intentionally, of course): partner bid a noticeably slow 3NT (all 4 players at the table including the 3NT bidder agreed that 3NT was slow).

[jdonn]

Well obviously then you have to pass, it's clear 3NT could be right.

[kenrexford]

Wildly curious what partner's hand was.

It seems like this freak hand would be especially suited for a somewhat unusual approach that I worked up recently, where a 2♦ opening shows a strong hand with at least four spades. Presumably Responder lacks four spades, with which he would deny fit by bidding 2♥, after which I would bid 3♦ to show a strong hand with a spade-diamond canape. With a technical 3-loser hand (practical 4-loser hand) and 8 quick tricks at notrump, this hand would (barely) qualify.

So, I'm curious for my own benefit what Responder held. Care to share?

[crazy4hoop]

Responder held ♠Jxx ♥Qxx ♦xxx ♣KJxx

This hand came up at a club game recently and my opinion was asked about what opener should do. I was leaning pass until I heard about the BIT where it almost now (maybe not almost - it does) make pass the ethical choice.

Opener insisted he had a slam try, citing that one Ace and the ♠K would probably be enough for 6♦ to make. I'm not sure if he forgot partner's 1NT was in the very wide (5)6-10 range and to play her for such specific cards would be overly optimistic. I am pretty sure the slow 3NT indicates doubt about a real heart stopper and makes it more likely that she potentially held something useful in the black suits.

It turns out I was not directing this day but was simply asked my opinion. The opponents didn't even call the director since 5♦ (the eventual landing spot) failed a trick but I have a feeling that they were not aware that 3NT would have sailed off 2.

Thanks again everyone for your comments.

[jdonn]

3NT is a really bad bid! But that's not surprising. Anyway yay for pulling, smaller minus

[aguahombre]

maybe redouble, instead of 3NT would express the same doubt as the hestitation seemed to. If so, then 3NT --whether slow or fast -- could have been passed, and had to be passed with the BIT.

This is no longer a 'bid more?" discussion, but rather a BIT discussion. But, if North had redoubled, 3NT might have been played from the other side --and possibly with a better result (West would have to lead a high heart, and the defenders don't always get it right).

[cherdanno]

I would suggest passing the double of 3H as suggesting doubt about a heart stopper. I would even suggest that's the normal way to play it.

[aguahombre]

cherdanno, on Feb 26 2010, 10:54 AM, said:

I would suggest passing the double of 3H as suggesting doubt about a heart stopper. I would even suggest that's the normal way to play it.

And then with no doubt and no stopper you can't use their double to pass and save room if you have nothing to say? Just asking.