[pbleighton]

Playing a standard 20-21 range for 2NT, what do you do with balanced 22 counts. I open some 2NT, and some 2C, depending on the hand.

What do you do?

Peter

[bhugi]

Quote

Playing a standard 20-21 range for 2NT, what do you do with balanced 22 counts. I open some 2NT, and some 2C, depending on the hand.

What do you do?

Peter

I play disipline bidding, no 14 hcp 1NT
So, for a balanced 22 (except for a QJ doubleton), I will open 2C and rebid lowest NT.
When multi 2D is available, 2D and rebid lowest NT = 22-23, 2C and rebid lowest NT = 24+

[EricK]

Quote

Playing a standard 20-21 range for 2NT, what do you do with balanced 22 counts. I open some 2NT, and some 2C, depending on the hand.

What do you do?

Peter

What you do is reasonable, although if you open a lot of them 2NT, then you are not really playing a 20-21 range.

You might consider playing a 21-22 range instead. If you have a balanced 20 point hand and partner passes your 1 level opening then it is unlikley you were making game, and even 2NT may be too high.

Eric

[the hog]

I think what Peter is on about here is the proliferation of a 5 card Major or a 6 card minor.
fwiw
I try to open 2N if my rebid will be difficult if I don't open with a strong bid. ie ALL 5332 shapes with a 5M qualify. Happy to open 4441 shapes in the required range IF I have a stiff A or K, also will open 6322 with a 6m if appropriate.
Downgrade unsupported honors; upgrade for a decent 5 card suit. Also prefer to play 2C 2H(very neg) 2N as ngf and
2C 2D(waiting) 2H 2S(forced) 2N as 24+ GF

Cheers
Ron

[Poky]

I play the same way as Bhugi.

2NT = 20-21 bal
2D multi = 22-23 bal
2C = 24+ bal.

Sometimes I open 2D with 21 HCP, [K10x AQx KQ109x AK]...
...and sometimes I open 2NT with 22 HCP, [AKQ 6542 AKQ A63]...
...depending of my own hand evaluation!!!

[Free]

In our region, the 2D bid is stronger than the 2C bid. Here we play

2C = 22-23
2D = 24+
2NT = 20-21

because normally 2C means semi-gameforcing, and 2D means gameforcing (both with weak hands to).

[mishovnbg]

Hi Peter!
12hcp - 12hcp and 24hcp in one hand make great difference in my opinion. Lack of communications and possibility to count directly tricks leads to deformations. One of such is you no need more to count 26(25)hcp for 3NT contract. Instead of it you can use simple language with primary tricks meaning. 2NT opening mean: "Partner, if you have 1 trick, we have game. This is why I open 2NT and not 1 in suit." You can count for 1 trick 1K, 2Q...
If you need less than 1K or 2Q for game, say 1 J, you can just suppouse that p have it, open 2CL and rebid 2NT as forcing to game.
Misho

[bhugi]

HCP count is just one of the bidding method, and it is too general, but easy to use.
A are under valued and Q J over valued.
Loser Trick Counts, Playing Trick Counts, Law of Total Tricks, Quick Tricks count, etc, has their own advantages.

Only when a NT contract with both hands balanced and HCP evenly distributed that HCP counts can be used stand alone to generate good result.

Personally I use Law of Total Tricks for competitive biddings, Quick Tricks count for defensive penalty doubles, Playing Trick Count for pre-empty bidding, and I used Loser Trick Counts the most, for suit contracts.

[Gerben47]

Hi, I like having two forcing opening bids to solve this problem (in my case 2C and 2D).

I for one play this:

11 - 13: 1NT (or 1x then 1NT)
14 - 16: 1x then 1NT (or 1NT directly)
17 - 18: 1x then 2NT
19 - 20: 2C then 2NT
21 - 22: 2NT
23 - 24: 2D then 2NT
25 - 26: 2C then 3NT
27 - 28: 2D then 3NT
29+: theoretically 2D then 4NT but don't wait up for it.

If you don't have two forcing opening bids you have a problem with 3-point ranges or having trouble with the real monsters.

If you play with one forcing bid I suggest playing 1x then 2NT as 18 - 20 and 2NT as 21 - 22.

It also helps if you can play 2D with both weak and strong variations, but this is not allowed in all countries.

Gerben

[Trpltrbl]

Quote

Playing a standard 20-21 range for 2NT, what do you do with balanced 22 counts. I open some 2NT, and some 2C, depending on the hand.

What do you do?

Peter

Some 22 counts look like a 20 count some 19 counts look like a 21 count. I play my 2 NT opening as good 19 - bad 22. Never gotten me in trouble yet. Playing solid bridge is nice but bridge is a game of judgement. There always will be hands that don't fit a certain bid prefectly, that's why we r always here discussing stuff That's what I am thinking about it.

Thx Mike ;D

[Trpltrbl]

Quote

I play the same way as Bhugi.

2NT = 20-21 bal
2D multi = 22-23 bal
2C = 24+ bal.

Sometimes I open 2D with 21 HCP, [K10x AQx KQ109x AK]...
...and sometimes I open 2NT with 22 HCP, [AKQ 6542 AKQ A63]...
...depending of my own hand evaluation!!!

Back in the Olden days when I was still playing in Europe, that was the way to go. Now that I play in USA Mutli and a lot of the other good stuff basically has been prohibited unless y play in certain tournaments. Y really can't practice anywhere but online to play this. SO I just, for now, converted back to just plain weak 2's. But I'll be BACK .

Mike ;D

[inquiry]

pbleighton, on Nov 5 2003, 09:13 PM, said:

Playing a standard 20-21 range for 2NT, what do you do with balanced 22 counts. I open some 2NT, and some 2C, depending on the hand.

What do you do?

I like use the idea that my multi-2D includes balanced hands that are 1) too good for a 2NT opening bid, and 2) Not good enough for a 2C followed by a jump to 3NT. This balanced range is a little fuzzy on the edges, but is roughly a good 22 to a bad 24. So, some 22 point hands are opened 2NT, some 2D.

So if I bid 2D with 22-24, and 2C followed by 3NT with good 24 or 25+. what does a bid of 2C followed by 2NT show?.... this is the three suiter hand, any short suit, see http://forums.bridgebase.com/in...ee+suiter"

Ben