[blackshoe]

So when are you gonna run for President and fix everything?

[Winstonm]

blackshoe, on Dec 19 2009, 11:16 PM, said:

So when are you gonna run for President and fix everything?

I'm holding out for king - here, King. Here, boy. Damn dog.

[Fluffy]

Gerben42, on Dec 19 2009, 09:32 AM, said:

Barry, why do you only nominate two US presidents? You might just as well take Russian president Putin or Germany's chancellor Merkel, they were very important and influential this decade.

Lol Gerben, you know why, because they haven't been important in america, and that's the only thing that matters.

[kenberg]

Lobowolf, on Dec 19 2009, 09:39 PM, said:

Heh.

btw with respect to the FDR excerpt, did you know that Italian-Americans and German-Americans were sent to internment camps, also?

This would amaze me if it means in any widespread way. I was aorund at the time and I grew up in Minnesota. Plenty of folks with German backgrounds there, and I never heard of it.

My direct experience is not quite a counter-example but still..
My father came here for Croatia and took out citizenship in something like 1937. As a child, I understood he came from Austria. Croatia was part of Austria-Hu ngary in 1910 when he arrived. Well Croatia is neither Austria nor Germany but there was absolutely no trouble He considered volunteering after Pearl, but my mother pointed out that he was forty-one, I was two, and maybe he should stay home. He went to work in a munitions factory at Rosemont, Minnesota. No questions asked.


I don't know which of my young friends were German and which weren't. I didn't think that way, and despite the best efforts of some to turn us all into hyphenated Americans, I still don't. But in Minnesota in the 40s, I don't believe it would have been possible for there to be a round-up of German-Americans that would have escaped my notice.

One other piece of evidence: I was chatting with a friend about childhood days. He is of German background and when, as a child, he heard of a great German victory on the radio he cheered. His mother explained the facts to mhim. He said nothing about any trouble, but he did learn not to cheer for the Germans.

One thing I learned just a few years ago: In Minnesota there were prisoner of war camps for Germans, and many of the prisoners were used as farm laborers. This was common in many places. I read some novel, set in Canada, about this practice.

[Lobowolf]

kenberg, on Dec 20 2009, 09:16 AM, said:

Lobowolf, on Dec 19 2009, 09:39 PM, said:

Heh.

btw with respect to the FDR excerpt, did you know that Italian-Americans and German-Americans were sent to internment camps, also?

This would amaze me if it means in any widespread way. I was aorund at the time and I grew up in Minnesota. Plenty of folks with German backgrounds there, and I never heard of it.

My direct experience is not quite a counter-example but still..
My father came here for Croatia and took out citizenship in something like 1937. As a child, I understood he came from Austria. Croatia was part of Austria-Hu ngary in 1910 when he arrived. Well Croatia is neither Austria nor Germany but there was absolutely no trouble He considered volunteering after Pearl, but my mother pointed out that he was forty-one, I was two, and maybe he should stay home. He went to work in a munitions factory at Rosemont, Minnesota. No questions asked.


I don't know which of my young friends were German and which weren't. I didn't think that way, and despite the best efforts of some to turn us all into hyphenated Americans, I still don't. But in Minnesota in the 40s, I don't believe it would have been possible for there to be a round-up of German-Americans that would have escaped my notice.

One other piece of evidence: I was chatting with a friend about childhood days. He is of German background and when, as a child, he heard of a great German victory on the radio he cheered. His mother explained the facts to mhim. He said nothing about any trouble, but he did learn not to cheer for the Germans.

One thing I learned just a few years ago: In Minnesota there were prisoner of war camps for Germans, and many of the prisoners were used as farm laborers. This was common in many places. I read some novel, set in Canada, about this practice.

A little over 10,000 I believe (German-Americans that is, not counting the Italian-Americans in that figure).

[kenberg]

From the Wikipedia:

Quote

Under the authority of the Alien Enemies Act of 1798, over 11,000 Germans and German Americans were selectively detained and interned at the start of World War II. In addition, over 4,500 ethnic Germans were brought to the U.S. from Latin America and detained. In many cases, the families of the internees were allowed to remain together at internment camps throughout the U.S. In others, families and even children were forced to fend for themselves. Limited due process was allowed for those arrested and detained.

Legislation was introduced in the United States Congress in 2001 to create an independent commission to review government policies on European "enemy" ethnic groups during the war.[1] An organization, the German American Internee Coalition, exists to publicize the "internment, repatriation and exchange of civilians of German ethnicity" during the war, and to seek U.S. government review and acknowledgment of civil rights violations involved.[2]

11,000, including both Germans and German Americans (the former presumably German citizens) is a number that I guess I can believe although I had not been aware of it. Given the number of Germans and Americans of Berman descent, it would seem some criteria were being applied.

The second paragraph speaks of exchanges. I know little about these but I believe that they occurred. Civilians who got caught being in the wrong place at the wrong time were, I think, often allowed to get back to the country of their citizenship. I think that this went in both directions, but my knowledge is unreliable.

I don't mean to discount the hardship, but in a time of war I can well imagine that there were 11,000 Germans and German Americans who were suspect. I would be interested in hearing about what this commission uncovered. And I guess I can imagine this happening without me hearing of it. It's a bit over 200 pre state. Minnesota has more than the average percentage of people of German heritage, but a lot of them were farmers and probably not on anyone's list for anything.

Incidentally, I thought that the Alien and Sedition act that was passed under Adams was repealed under Jefferson. Maybe I ma wrong, or maybe this is a different law that they are referring to. [This is not to be confused with Bimbo and Seduction act that was passed under Clinton.]


One thing I get out of this is that when a country sees itself in unusual danger it can get inventive about finding a legal basis for doing what it wants to do. That, I think, applies equally to Lincoln, FDR. and Bush.

[Winstonm]

Quote

[This is not to be confused with Bimbo and Seduction act that was passed under Clinton.]

This is factually incorrect - Clinton did not pass up the chance to Seduce the Bimbo.

Quote

One thing I get out of this is that when a country sees itself in unusual danger it can get inventive about finding a legal basis for doing what it wants to do. That, I think, applies equally to Lincoln, FDR. and Bush.

I agree except I would replace "country" with "those in power", which of course then means that singular "sees" would become a shiny, new plural "see", which probably explains how we came up with the lyrical idea of "from Sees to shiny See."

[Gerben42]

Quote

Dubya is the person that definitely dominated the last decade.

Well, to be honest, Dubya brought us the plastic bags for not bringing liquid on the plane. And Google just brought us... Google.

[mike777]

9/11 was THE EVENT of the decade and really set up the rest of the decade.


Whoever was behind 9/11 was the person of the decade. If that is Bin Laden, so be it.

[luke warm]

i think they voted too soon... it appears that obama has taken the gloves off... how bout that? a war president

Quote

On orders from President Barack Obama, the U.S. military launched cruise missiles early Thursday against two suspected al-Qaeda sites in Yemen, administration officials told ABC News in a report broadcast on ABC World News with Charles Gibson.

One of the targeted sites was a suspected al Qaeda training camp north of the capitol, Sanaa, and the second target was a location where officials said "an imminent attack against a U.S. asset was being planned."
The Yemen attacks by the U.S. military represent a major escalation of the Obama administration's campaign against al Qaeda.

i'm sure glad he waited to do this else he'd never have gotten this

[hrothgar]

luke warm, on Dec 22 2009, 02:09 AM, said:

i think they voted too soon... it appears that obama has taken the gloves off... how bout that? a war president

I wasn't aware that Obama - or anyone in the Obama administration for that matter - actually used that expression.

Quite honesty, I associate grandious titles like that one with insecure Oedipal little twits like the Shrub.

You can rightfully mock Bush for playing Emperor and pretending that he was the "big man". Obama never claimed to be war president. He never claimed to the peace president for that matter.

As for the Nobel peace prize: Three simple questions

1. Do you think that Obama was lobbying to be awarded the prize in any way, shape, or form?

2. Once Obama was awarded the price, what should he have done with it?

3. What do you think of Obama's speech? As I recall, I got very high reviews from most everyone....

[blackshoe]

"page does not exist"

[luke warm]

hrothgar, on Dec 21 2009, 06:20 PM, said:

luke warm, on Dec 22 2009, 02:09 AM, said:

i think they voted too soon... it appears that obama has taken the gloves off... how bout that? a war president

I wasn't aware that Obama - or anyone in the Obama administration for that matter - actually used that expression.

Quite honesty, I associate grandious titles like that one with insecure Oedipal little twits like the Shrub.

You can rightfully mock Bush for playing Emperor and pretending that he was the "big man". Obama never claimed to be war president. He never claimed to the peace president for that matter.

i never said he (or his admin) thought of himself as a war president... i called him that

Quote

As for the Nobel peace prize:  Three simple questions

1.  Do you think that Obama was lobbying to be awarded the prize in any way, shape, or form?

no

Quote

2.  Once Obama was awarded the price, what should he have done with it?

accepted it

Quote

3.  What do you think of Obama's speech?  As I recall, I got very high reviews from most everyone....

excellent speech - most of his speeches are

blackshoe, on Dec 21 2009, 06:26 PM, said:

"page does not exist"

sorry bout that... try now

[gwnn]

this:

http://abcnews.go.com/Blotter/cruise-missi...tory?id=9375236

[hrothgar]

luke warm, on Dec 22 2009, 02:51 AM, said:

hrothgar, on Dec 21 2009, 06:20 PM, said:

luke warm, on Dec 22 2009, 02:09 AM, said:

i think they voted too soon... it appears that obama has taken the gloves off... how bout that? a war president

I wasn't aware that Obama - or anyone in the Obama administration for that matter - actually used that expression.

Quite honesty, I associate grandious titles like that one with insecure Oedipal little twits like the Shrub.

You can rightfully mock Bush for playing Emperor and pretending that he was the "big man". Obama never claimed to be war president. He never claimed to the peace president for that matter.

i never said he (or his admin) thought of himself as a war president... i called him that

Quote

As for the Nobel peace prize:  Three simple questions

1.  Do you think that Obama was lobbying to be awarded the prize in any way, shape, or form?

no

Quote

2.  Once Obama was awarded the price, what should he have done with it?

accepted it

Quote

3.  What do you think of Obama's speech?  As I recall, I got very high reviews from most everyone....

excellent speech - most of his speeches are

So, Obama pretty much got it all correct and you're still acting like a whiny little bitch...

[luke warm]

hrothgar, on Dec 21 2009, 07:28 PM, said:

luke warm, on Dec 22 2009, 02:51 AM, said:

hrothgar, on Dec 21 2009, 06:20 PM, said:

luke warm, on Dec 22 2009, 02:09 AM, said:

i think they voted too soon... it appears that obama has taken the gloves off... how bout that? a war president

I wasn't aware that Obama - or anyone in the Obama administration for that matter - actually used that expression.

Quite honesty, I associate grandious titles like that one with insecure Oedipal little twits like the Shrub.

You can rightfully mock Bush for playing Emperor and pretending that he was the "big man". Obama never claimed to be war president. He never claimed to the peace president for that matter.

i never said he (or his admin) thought of himself as a war president... i called him that

Quote

As for the Nobel peace prize:  Three simple questions

1.  Do you think that Obama was lobbying to be awarded the prize in any way, shape, or form?

no

Quote

2.  Once Obama was awarded the price, what should he have done with it?

accepted it

Quote

3.  What do you think of Obama's speech?  As I recall, I got very high reviews from most everyone....

excellent speech - most of his speeches are

So, Obama pretty much got it all correct and you're still acting like a whiny little bitch...

i have no idea what you're talking about... i think you might have a problem understanding what people write... you're the one sounding like a whiny little bitch

[hrothgar]

luke warm, on Dec 22 2009, 02:05 PM, said:

i have no idea what you're talking about... i think you might have a problem understanding what people write... you're the one sounding like a whiny little bitch

So, what was the point of your original post?

1. You seem to to agree with the steps that Obama took regarding the Nobel Peace Prize, so you can't criticizing this...

2. I don't recall many people on this site saying that they were voting for Obama based on his policies in Iraq / Afghanistan.

Lobowolf conducted a poll and only three out of 35 people said that Iraq was the primary reason that they were voting for Obama.

http://forums.bridge...topic=28221&hl=

I stated the following:

Quote

If I had to choose between the items listed in the poll, I'd say "Values/better person than the other candidate". However, I would essentially be using this as a proxy for "style of governance".

Obama has impressed me for a long time.

He seems very intelligent, thoughtful, articulate, and seems inflappable.

He put together the best run campaign that I have ever seen. (He dismanted the Clinton machine which had been plotting a comeback for 8+ years. This took a LOT of work and a lot of executive competence).

I'm quite sure that I'm going to have issues with any number of policies that come out of an Obama White House. Even so, I expect that I can trust the decision making process.

Simply put,

If your post isn't commenting on Obama's actual behavior AND your post isn't directed at anyone on the site, just why are bothering post this crap?

I think whiny (and impotent) bitching is a pretty fair description. Every couple weeks you wander onto the site, post a bunch of random complaints or recycle some poorly understood Conservative talking points, and then wander off into the darkness once again...

[kenberg]

Phooey. I put my reply in the wrong thread. If interested, go to


http://forums.bridgebase.com/index.php?act...225#entry419269

[luke warm]

hrothgar, on Dec 22 2009, 06:54 AM, said:

luke warm, on Dec 22 2009, 02:05 PM, said:

i have no idea what you're talking about... i think you might have a problem understanding what people write... you're the one sounding like a whiny little bitch

So, what was the point of your original post?

i was simply making a statement that obama appears to be a better wartime consigliere than i originally thought... hell, i'm proud of him... the best terrorist is a dead terrorist, doncha know

[Al_U_Card]

luke warm, on Dec 22 2009, 02:39 PM, said:

hrothgar, on Dec 22 2009, 06:54 AM, said:

luke warm, on Dec 22 2009, 02:05 PM, said:

i have no idea what you're talking about... i think you might have a problem understanding what people write... you're the one sounding like a whiny little bitch

So, what was the point of your original post?

i was simply making a statement that obama appears to be a better wartime consigliere than i originally thought... hell, i'm proud of him... the best terrorist is a dead terrorist, doncha know

Does that include the Minutemen?

Location, location location.... is the most important because it provides viewpoint and perspective...