[bd71]

Scoring: IMP

How would you bid this?

Honestly, I don't recall our path to 6H, easily making 7. But seems like this grand should be biddable. Is this best?

1♣ 1♦
1♥ 2♠* 4SGF. 1♠ is natural per our agreements
3♣ 3♥
3♠* 4♦* Cue bids (is it right not to cue the club void in partner's suit?)
4N* 5♠* 1430; 2 keycard with QH.
5N* 6♥ Asking kings; showing 2 non-trump kings.
7♥

---

[TylerE]

1♣ - 1♥ (Higher of equal lengths holding 5-5!)
4♥ - 4♠
5♣ - 5♦
4♠ - 6♦
7♥

(4♠ - 6♦ are cues)

[jh51]

This is bd71's partner. My recollection is that my response was 1♥ to partner's opener, but I don't recall the rest of the auction either. I think his next bid may have been 3♥ and I may have just jumped to 6♥ as I did not know how to bid it scientifically.

[pooltuna]

bd71, on Dec 7 2009, 10:51 PM, said:

Scoring: IMP

How would you bid this?

Honestly, I don't recall our path to 6H, easily making 7. But seems like this grand should be biddable. Is this best?

1♣ 1♦
1♥ 2♠* 4SGF. 1♠ is natural per our agreements
3♣ 3♥
3♠* 4♦* Cue bids (is it right not to cue the club void in partner's suit?)
4N* 5♠* 1430; 2 keycard with QH.
5N* 6♥ Asking kings; showing 2 non-trump kings.
7♥

---

well for the less scientific
1♣ 1♥
4♥ 6♦
7♥

[bd71]

jh51, on Dec 8 2009, 10:11 AM, said:

My recollection is that my response was 1♥ to partner's opener, but I don't recall the rest of the auction either.

Jeff, so be both don't remember the auction...but I believe I (South) ended up as declarer in hearts. My conclusion is that you must have bid 1D initially...which I think is very reasonable as it's your stronger suit and you can easily reverse into hearts with your strength.

[TylerE]

Hate a responder reverse with 5-5. A reverse *promises* longer length in the first suit...so 5-4, 6-4, 6-5, 7-5, etc.

[mike777]

uhh ya...you really need to start with 1h here with equal length. Agree with tuna bidding.

[ONEferBRID]

♣

TylerE, on Dec 7 2009, 11:41 PM, said:

1♣ - 1♥ (Higher of equal lengths holding 5-5!)
4♥ - 4♠
5♣ - 5♦
4♠ - 6♦
7♥

(4♠ - 6♦ are cues)

Agree, it should start:
1♣ - 1♥ ...
but then Opener could use the "Convention With No Name "
4♣ jump = ostensibly showing a 6c/4h hand with most values concentrated in the 2 suits, and enough values ( ~19hcp ) to force game, even if partner had a minimum 1M Response.
The bid has the same effect as the 4♥ jump, but besides the shape-showing/point concentration, here there is "room" for cuebids at the 4-level if Responder is interested:

4♣ - 4♦ ( cue )
4♠ ( could be A, K, void or singleton; but it must be the Ace or else Opener
would not have enough values -- based on Responder's hand-- for the 4♣ jump ).

Responder could just jump to 7♥ at this point.
But just to make sure, he goes 4NT ( RKC for ♥ ).

And , as expected, the reply is:
5♣ ( 3 keys ) - 7♥

[Vilgan]

TylerE, on Dec 7 2009, 11:41 PM, said:

1♣ - 1♥ (Higher of equal lengths holding 5-5!)
4♥ - 4♠
5♣ - 5♦
4♠ - 6♦
7♥

(4♠ - 6♦ are cues)

Why would north cue bid when all he cares about is 2 aces? I don't know that cue bidding Ks above game is terribly standard either.

1♣ 1♥
4♥ 4NT
5♦ 7♥

4NT = keycard
5♦ = 0/3, but if you play 3014 then bid would be 5♣

Seems like a much more normal and realistic auction. Assume partner has an A in clubs and bid accordingly. If they show 2 stop at 6. If they show 1, stop at 5. Since they have shown 3, 7♥ is a trivial bid.

As others have said, the main mistake is bidding diamonds first. bid higher of equal length first.

[Vilgan]

bd71, on Dec 7 2009, 10:51 PM, said:

Scoring: IMP

How would you bid this?

Honestly, I don't recall our path to 6H, easily making 7. But seems like this grand should be biddable. Is this best?

1♣ 1♦
1♥ 2♠* 4SGF. 1♠ is natural per our agreements
3♣ 3♥
3♠* 4♦* Cue bids (is it right not to cue the club void in partner's suit?)
4N* 5♠* 1430; 2 keycard with QH.
5N* 6♥ Asking kings; showing 2 non-trump kings.
7♥

---

Assuming your hand is a bit different, say Kx KQxxx AKQTxx -, then the auction is not unreasonable. North should probably jump to 7♥ as soon as partner bids 5NT though as 5NT should guarantee all the keycards. Opposite 3 aces, north can count 13 tricks.

[TylerE]

Keycard with the north hand is terrible.

Do you want to miss 7 opposite

AQJ
Axxx
J
KQJxx

Saying that you're going to assume one of them is the A!C == lOL

[Vilgan]

TylerE, on Dec 9 2009, 10:47 AM, said:

Keycard with the north hand is terrible.

Do you want to miss 7 opposite

AQJ
Axxx
J
KQJxx

Saying that you're going to assume one of them is the A!C == lOL

Yes, because no disasters could ever happen after you cue bid a king above game instead of an ace. Like say.. partner believes you, leaps to 7♥ after the 5♦ cue, and the opps cash the A of spades.

Obviously, the best sequence if playing exclusion above game instead of cue bids (my preference but I've seen experts do it as well):

1♣ 1♥
4♥ 5♣*
5♠ 7♥

* = tell me about keycards outside of clubs

Asking for keycards despite a void is still going to work most of the time with north's hand. You get to 7 when S has 3 aces. You avoid a bad grand when one of south's 2 aces is the A in the suit he opened. And when it doesn't work, you'll end up in a making small slam making 7 (not an end of the world result for B/I) instead of in a grand off a cashing ace. "omg don't ever bid keycard with a void!!" is a good rule, but like most rules.. it doesn't mean you always blindly follow it.

If you are going to cue bid, at least don't lie:

1♣ 1♥
4♥ 5♦
5♠ ?

Several routes to go from there.

[P_Marlowe]

bd71, on Dec 8 2009, 12:19 PM, said:

jh51, on Dec 8 2009, 10:11 AM, said:

My recollection is that my response was 1♥ to partner's opener, but I don't recall the rest of the auction either.

Jeff, so be both don't remember the auction...but I believe I (South) ended up as declarer in hearts. My conclusion is that you must have bid 1D initially...which I think is very reasonable as it's your stronger suit and you can easily reverse into hearts with your strength.

1H, not 1D.

It is all very well, that you are strong enough to make the reverse,
but if you start with diamonds, partner will bever give you 5-5.
Just rememer, that shape is more important than HCP.

With kind regards
Marlowe