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Splinter or not?

Poll: 1H-1S-? (19 member(s) have cast votes)

1H-1S-?

  1. 2S (8 votes [42.11%])

    Percentage of vote: 42.11%

  2. 3C=splinter, 12-14 or 18-19 (11 votes [57.89%])

    Percentage of vote: 57.89%

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#1 User is offline   kgr 

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Posted 2009-November-25, 08:36

Scoring: IMP

1♥-1♠
??
 
We have the agreement that 3♣ is a ♣ splinter with 4c♠ and 12-14 or 18-19. And 2♠ is a normal raise (we don't raise often with a 3c♠).
My partner prefers 3♣ to show an unbalanced distribution. 2♠ would show a more balanced hand.
I prefer 2♠ because with the minimal hand the ♣Q singleton is not worth to be mentioned. Partner will also mis-evaluate ♣Kxxx and with ♣xxxx he will expect more pts in the other suits.
....Given the bidding agreements, what bid do you prefer?
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#2 User is offline   gwnn 

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Posted 2009-November-25, 08:38

I don't understand. Your partner likes a splinter to show an unbalanced hand and you don't? Why not? I think your partner has a point.
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#3 User is offline   helene_t 

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Posted 2009-November-25, 08:40

12-14 means that 12 is the minimum strength for an unbalanced opener? If so I have to splinter wiht this hand according to system I think. Then again maybe I shouldn't have opened this hand.

I take it that this hand evaluates to 12 (since I opened) so I voted 3♣. If 12-14 is meant to exclude minimal hands, though, I would bid 2♠.
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#4 User is offline   billw55 

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Posted 2009-November-25, 08:49

So if 3♣ is splinter after 1♥-1♠, then how would you bid Kx AKJxx x KQJxx or similar? Just curious ...
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#5 User is offline   kgr 

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Posted 2009-November-25, 08:51

billw55, on Nov 25 2009, 04:49 PM, said:

So if 3♣ is splinter after 1♥-1♠, then how would you bid Kx AKJxx x KQJxx or similar? Just curious ...

2♣ forcing.
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#6 User is offline   kenrexford 

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Posted 2009-November-25, 08:54

I don't understand why we would have an agreement to force the three-level with 12 HCP and a stiff. I understand this less when we have 9 HCP and a stiff.
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#7 User is offline   andy_h 

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Posted 2009-November-25, 09:13

Given the bidding agreements, I bid 3♣ if it shows my hand. Long time ago I used to play this style as well and had come to hate it. If your partner prefers 3♣ to be unbalanced just like we have here, then isn't it better if we bid this so he can judge better as he will be expecting 2♠ to be the balanced type.
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#8 User is offline   kgr 

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Posted 2009-November-25, 09:24

gwnn, on Nov 25 2009, 04:38 PM, said:

I don't understand. Your partner likes a splinter to show an unbalanced hand and you don't? Why not? I think your partner has a point.

I would if ♣Q was ♦Q or ♠Q, but with singleton Q I think 3♣ gives a misdescription of where my points are?
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#9 User is offline   billw55 

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Posted 2009-November-25, 09:25

kgr, on Nov 25 2009, 09:51 AM, said:

billw55, on Nov 25 2009, 04:49 PM, said:

So if 3♣ is splinter after 1♥-1♠, then how would you bid Kx AKJxx x KQJxx or similar?  Just curious ...

2♣ forcing.

Ok, I'm with you so far.

So then what if you hold say x KJxxx Qxx AQxx and wish to rebid 2♣ nonforcing?
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#10 User is offline   kgr 

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Posted 2009-November-25, 09:34

billw55, on Nov 25 2009, 05:25 PM, said:

kgr, on Nov 25 2009, 09:51 AM, said:

billw55, on Nov 25 2009, 04:49 PM, said:

So if 3♣ is splinter after 1♥-1♠, then how would you bid Kx AKJxx x KQJxx or similar?  Just curious ...

2♣ forcing.

Ok, I'm with you so far.

So then what if you hold say x KJxxx Qxx AQxx and wish to rebid 2♣ nonforcing?

1NT (we rather bid 1NT on hands like that because we play 2C forcing)
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#11 User is offline   gnasher 

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Posted 2009-November-25, 10:20

If "12-14" means "12-14 in high cards", then this is a 2♠ bid, because this hand doesn't contain 12 HCP.

If "12-14" really means "opening strength up to 14 HCP", then it's a splinter. This hand is closer to A9xx KQxxx Qxx x than to A9xx KQxxx xx Qx.
... that would still not be conclusive proof, before someone wants to explain that to me as well as if I was a 5 year-old. - gwnn
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#12 User is offline   jdonn 

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Posted 2009-November-25, 10:31

I love the splinter since you can make it on the 3 level. It shows a minimum strength hand, which you have. Your playing strength is very good, so go for it.
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#13 User is offline   Jlall 

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Posted 2009-November-25, 14:33

3C
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#14 User is offline   P_Marlowe 

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Posted 2009-November-25, 14:41

Hi,

Given the 6-4 distribution, the hand is worth a splinter.
In general, if I would ever play your agreement set, I would always
make the splinter, i.e. 2S ist either a 3 card raise or 5422, and if you
rule out 3 card raises, 5422 it is.
Of course you can also say, that the splinter showes a real opening bid
you are not ashamed of, and than some submin openers will have to go
via 2S as well.

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Marlowe
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#15 User is offline   P_Marlowe 

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Posted 2009-November-25, 14:43

kgr, on Nov 25 2009, 10:24 AM, said:

gwnn, on Nov 25 2009, 04:38 PM, said:

I don't understand. Your partner likes a splinter to show an unbalanced hand and you don't? Why not? I think your partner has a point.

I would if ♣Q was ♦Q or ♠Q, but with singleton Q I think 3♣ gives a misdescription of where my points are?

The question is, why did you open the hand in the first place?
Rule of 20 with the single Queen?

With kind regards
Marlowe
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#16 User is offline   nige1 

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Posted 2009-November-25, 14:47

kgr, on Nov 25 2009, 09:36 AM, said:

Scoring: IMP

1♥-1♠
??
We have the agreement that 3♣ is a ♣ splinter with 4c♠ and 12-14 or 18-19. And 2♠ is a normal raise (we don't raise often with a 3c♠).
My partner prefers 3♣ to show an unbalanced distribution. 2♠ would show a more balanced hand.
I prefer 2♠ because with the minimal hand the ♣Q singleton is not worth to be mentioned. Partner will also mis-evaluate ♣Kxxx and with ♣xxxx he will expect more pts in the other suits.
....Given the bidding agreements, what bid do you prefer?

IMO 3♣ = 10, 3♠ = 6, 2♠ = 5.
Guthrie.tech
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