[bid_em_up]

bill1157, on Nov 17 2009, 10:04 AM, said:

that hand is a 2♠ opener vulnerable vs not.

Bill

possibly so, but it will be impossible to open 2♠ when RHO just opened 1N in front of you.

[jdonn]

Echognome, on Nov 17 2009, 01:25 PM, said:

jdonn, on Nov 17 2009, 09:52 AM, said:

Phil, on Nov 17 2009, 10:19 AM, said:

On the record for 4♠.

I have not been convinced of the arguments for 4♥.

Has anyone made any?

I'll make the case. Suppose partner has a few hearts and his spades aren't as great as we all think. Say he has KQT9xxx Txx Kx x.

Partner with great spades and a singleton/void heart is welcome to bring it back to 4♠ (which happened at the table). If his suit is self supporting, he knows where to play.

So why not give him the option?

Seriously?

[Echognome]

jdonn, on Nov 17 2009, 12:41 PM, said:

Echognome, on Nov 17 2009, 01:25 PM, said:

jdonn, on Nov 17 2009, 09:52 AM, said:

Phil, on Nov 17 2009, 10:19 AM, said:

On the record for 4♠.

I have not been convinced of the arguments for 4♥.

Has anyone made any?

I'll make the case. Suppose partner has a few hearts and his spades aren't as great as we all think. Say he has KQT9xxx Txx Kx x.

Partner with great spades and a singleton/void heart is welcome to bring it back to 4♠ (which happened at the table). If his suit is self supporting, he knows where to play.

So why not give him the option?

Seriously?

Hard for me to now say "Ha ha ha. Just kidding!" isn't it?

I was just figuring that partner may be able to judge whether his suit is playable or not? Maybe he has AJ9xxxx xxx xxx A or something? Maybe I'm kidding myself and I should have just bid 4♠.

[cherdanno]

I hope partner does not have AJ9xxxx xxx xxx A! And if you remove a red card, I would hope he would not bid 3S with that hand!

[Jlall]

gnasher, on Nov 16 2009, 05:54 PM, said:

Jlall, on Nov 16 2009, 10:05 PM, said:

KQJxxxx and out is a 3S bid red/white over 1N?

Is weak jump overcall even standard over 1N red/white? Genuinely asking, I thought it was usually played as intermediate.

I think that at any vulnerability the objective should be preemption. Even at adverse, a hand that wants to invite game must be even rarer than one that wants to preempt.

That doesn't, however, mean that it should be as weak as KQJxxxx x xx xxx. I suspect that faced with that hand I wouldn't be able to resist the temptation, at least at IMPs. I wouldn't do it at matchpoints though.

If this is on the cusp for me, I suppose that means it's a normal 2♠ for most of the world.

Sure I agree, but if the hand required to preempt is so strong in playing strength that it ends up giving you good game chances, I think it could be defined as intermediate. Something like AQJTxxxx x KJxx x looks like a 3S bid to me, whether or not the main goal is to preempt them or to find a save or to find a game I wouldn't call this a weak jump overcall. With hands like the ones posted which look like classical opening preempts, I would view it as too dangerous to get in there (I mean honestly KQJ seventh and out seems suicidal to me red/white).

[Phil]

Inflation has crept in. Two 14 carders....