[suokko]

Scoring: IMP

.

1♣(15-17 1NT)-3♣(invite);
3NT-ap

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Local swiss teams tournament, last round and last board (36 boards total). Clock is 11PM in Thursday evening and set has been full of boring hands with 2 part score battles(you have won both with ♠) and 3 easy to bid cold games. You are in the top table with 4 VPs lead over your opponents (3rd team is already 14 VPs behind). Both opponents are in top 20 of Finnish master point ranking if it matters.

Carding method in use is

• 3rd/5th leads
  
• UDCA
  
• smith echo (high promises some help in led suit)
  
• First discard o/e (odd encourages, even is S/P)
  
• Lavinthal

♥8 T J K
♣J 7 5 ?
♣6 3 A ?
♣K ? 2 ♠2

What do you play to 3 question marks? What is your defense plan? What 2 discards you do next?

partner's next discard is

Spoiler

spade Q

.

[Fluffy]

4, 9 and 10: no hearts, diamonds please.

[Codo]

Partner gave 7,3 in club? You play smtih peter, high pos. So, this shows some help in the suit led, so he must hold the ace of heart, something like A98x(x)

I would give the 9, showing the heart queen and later T,4 to show that my spades are much better then the diamonds.

There is no problem in misleading partner, because he must switch to heart anyway, but mabye this will give declarer the choice to make the spade finesse instead of the one in diamond.

[suokko]

It would be interesting to hear two discards tat you would make. Also your guess on what declarer has in terms of shape and honors (and tricks).

[dellache]

The distribution is known : pard has 4=4=3=2.
His HCP are known : he has exactly 11HCP.
Pard just refused spades : he doesn't have ♠AHx2
Pard led a Heart, not a spade : he doesn't have ♥A98x, unless he has also ♠Axxx (with another Spade honor combination and ♥Axx2, he would lead a Spade).
Opp took the King from AK in Heart : he'd be happy with a Heart continuation (mmmm...) ?
Pard discarded ♠2 : he has probably some diamond honor(s).
Pard played the ♣9 first : I don't know what to do with that, does he play "reverse-smith by the opening leader" ?

I would not be surprised pard has exactly Axxx 98xx AKx 9x (edit).

What does PARD know whatever I play on Clubs :
- dec has (13)14 HCP ;
- dec is 4333, 3433 or 4423 ;
- I cannot have ♥AQJx.

Well well, on this board, I really don't think we cannot do something wrong in defense. I will just clarify the situation to my pard, the decision maker, by playing :
- ♣10 (I have ♥Q), ♣2 (nothing special in ♠), ♣9, ♠8 then ♠10 (I have something in Diamonds, and nothing in Spades).

Hope I didnot do something silly.

[Fluffy]

ok, just to clarify

♣4 I don't have ♥KQJ in case you wondered.
♣9 I don't want you to play spades
♣10 I cannot signal on this trick
♠10 I Said I didn't want you to play spades don't you understand?
♠8 Hell, bang down your ♦AK ASAP.

[dellache]

Fluffy, on Nov 6 2009, 03:20 AM, said:

♣4 I don't have ♥KQJ in case you wondered.

I guessed pard would already have known, unless in Finland, there are two kings in each suit .

[suokko]

Fluffy: 3NT +1 (Our results at table; This was too hard deal after long day)
dellache: 3NT =

and no reverse smith from opener leader. Trying to keep it simple

Another partnership knowledge is that A98x might cause lead to be x in case partner has
2 of KQJT so we can finesse declares KT7x or similar combination. That means 8 lead is either from 876(xx) or A987(x).

[Trumpace]

<deleted>

[Fluffy]

FFS I missed the 3/5 lead thing O_o.

[dellache]

suokko, on Nov 6 2009, 12:55 PM, said:

That means 8 lead is either from 876(xx) or A987(x).

We obviously don't have the same definitions of 3rd/5th. Obviously it depends from the lattitude in Europe.

Here in my village, 3rd/5th would mean the 8 can come only from 98xx or A98x (4 cards suit is 100%). With A987x or 876xx lead the smallest (the FIFTH !!)

Huh ? Maybe I'm confused with 3rd filth.

[suokko]

dellache, on Nov 6 2009, 08:03 PM, said:

suokko, on Nov 6 2009, 12:55 PM, said:

That means 8 lead is either from 876(xx) or A987(x).

We obviously don't have the same definitions of 3rd/5th. Obviously it depends from the lattitude in Europe.

Here in my village, 3rd/5th would mean the 8 can come only from 98xx or A98x (4 cards suit is 100%). With A987x or 876xx lead the smallest (the FIFTH !!)

Huh ? Maybe I'm confused with 3rd filth.

We lead 1st/3td/5th always except from 4 card holding where we want to protect important spot card for later use.

A98x ha important spot cards for later use but A987x would lead 8 just in case that there is something to finesse from dummy. leading 2nd highest is never done. (unless psychic)

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[dellache]

suokko, on Nov 6 2009, 11:13 PM, said:

dellache, on Nov 6 2009, 08:03 PM, said:

suokko, on Nov 6 2009, 12:55 PM, said:

That means 8 lead is either from 876(xx) or A987(x).

We obviously don't have the same definitions of 3rd/5th. Obviously it depends from the lattitude in Europe.

Here in my village, 3rd/5th would mean the 8 can come only from 98xx or A98x (4 cards suit is 100%). With A987x or 876xx lead the smallest (the FIFTH !!)

Huh ? Maybe I'm confused with 3rd filth.

We lead 1st/3td/5th always except from 4 card holding where we want to protect important spot card for later use.

A98x ha important spot cards for later use but A987x would lead 8 just in case that there is something to finesse from dummy. leading 2nd highest is never done. (unless psychic)

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This is not what we usually call 3rd/5th imo. See definition HERE.

I've never seen somebody who leads A9(8)7x and claim it's 3rd/5th. Actually if I'm declarer, AND if 3rd/5th is mentioned on the CC, AND if I fail because of that, I would call the TD.

[suokko]

dellache, on Nov 7 2009, 10:28 AM, said:

suokko, on Nov 6 2009, 11:13 PM, said:

dellache, on Nov 6 2009, 08:03 PM, said:

suokko, on Nov 6 2009, 12:55 PM, said:

That means 8 lead is either from 876(xx) or A987(x).

We obviously don't have the same definitions of 3rd/5th. Obviously it depends from the lattitude in Europe.

Here in my village, 3rd/5th would mean the 8 can come only from 98xx or A98x (4 cards suit is 100%). With A987x or 876xx lead the smallest (the FIFTH !!)

Huh ? Maybe I'm confused with 3rd filth.

We lead 1st/3td/5th always except from 4 card holding where we want to protect important spot card for later use.

A98x ha important spot cards for later use but A987x would lead 8 just in case that there is something to finesse from dummy. leading 2nd highest is never done. (unless psychic)

---

This is not what we usually call 3rd/5th imo. See definition HERE.

I've never seen somebody who leads A9(8)7x and claim it's 3rd/5th. Actually if I'm declarer, AND if 3rd/5th is mentioned on the CC, AND if I fail because of that, I would call the TD.

By definition 3rd includes interior sequence from 5 card suit which you lead the 3rd highest. And I think this is standard lead definition for special combinations of cards. Also it is very possible to lead highest from 5 card suit in case of you think it is the most important info for partner.

I don't think you will ever get adjusted score wrong these kind of leads because there is no rule opening leader has to lead strictly using count only.

[dellache]

suokko, on Nov 7 2009, 02:09 PM, said:

By definition 3rd includes interior sequence from 5 card suit which you lead the 3rd highest. And I think this is standard lead definition for special combinations of cards [justifying the lead of the 8 in A9872]. Also it is very possible to lead highest from 5 card suit in case of you think it is the most important info for partner.

I don't think you will ever get adjusted score wrong these kind of leads because there is no rule opening leader has to lead strictly using count only.

Ah.

If you define what an interior sequence is on your CC, why not. Last day I had an "expert" pard on bbo who led the 6 from A6542 leading 4th best. He explained me that he had to lead an interior sequence. I was enlightened.