[barryallen]

Scoring: IMP

bidding 1♦-1♠-1NT-3NT

lead ♥2

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What would your play be for the above contract?

[Hanoi5]

♥10? Win the spade continuation with the ♠K and continue with another heart finesse (in case it's needed). I make at least 9 tricks.

[dellache]

Depending on what happens on the Hearts, I will surely duck a Spade at some point in order to make an extra trick when South has the ♣K. This seems too easy, did I miss something ?

[Fluffy]

finally an easy problem!. ♥10, I am soon claiming at least 9 tricks.

[gwnn]

yes even i'd make this

[pooltuna]

Fluffy, on Nov 1 2009, 10:07 AM, said:

finally an easy problem!. ♥10, I am soon claiming at least 9 tricks.

easy for game but this is an overtrick problem even if it is IMPS. So I agree with those who play the T♥ losing to the J and duck the ♠ return.

[Old York]

pooltuna, on Nov 1 2009, 05:13 PM, said:

easy for game but this is an overtrick problem even if it is IMPS

I hate to disagree, but imps is imps

♥10 or ♥Queen @ trick 1 guarantees the contract, later establishing a second club trick

Your only concern at imps is to secure the contract. Overtricks have little value
Now, if this was matchpoints......

Tony

Edit: Even ♥Ace works, oppo can only take ♥KJ

[pooltuna]

Old York, on Nov 1 2009, 11:56 AM, said:

pooltuna, on Nov 1 2009, 05:13 PM, said:

easy for game but this is an overtrick problem even if it is IMPS

I hate to disagree, but imps is imps

♥10 or ♥Queen @ trick 1 guarantees the contract, later establishing a second club trick

Your only concern at imps is to secure the contract. Overtricks have little value
Now, if this was matchpoints......

Tony

Edit: Even ♥Ace works, oppo can only take ♥KJ

Generally speaking you are correct when you say the contract comes first. However in this instance you are wrong as it is virtually certain to make so you need to make every effort to make whatever overtricks you can secure. Perhaps you can suggest a defense that is setting this 3NT contract where the line for OTs makes a difference?

[dellache]

Old York, on Nov 1 2009, 04:56 PM, said:

♥10 or ♥Queen @ trick 1 guarantees the contract, later establishing a second club trick

Your only concern at imps is to secure the contract. Overtricks have little value

Allez, let's disagree .
This is only true if your contract is in minor jeopardy. Garbage Imps are important. Say your team can average +1 imp per board, and you would be unbeatable.

There are many different ways to achieve that : call all "unbidable" 55% white slams (+1 imp average), find an amazing 100% line in 1NT when your oppos play on a double finesse, or just find the way to collect the garbage imps that are so often available.

For those who care, there's an excellent chapter about this in a book from Joe Boeder. Maybe available HERE. A very good american book.

Regards,

[Old York]

pooltuna, on Nov 1 2009, 06:24 PM, said:

Perhaps you can suggest a defense that is setting this 3NT contract where the line for OTs makes a difference?

Give North ♠QJT9 ♥KJ(x) ♦xxx ♣Kxx

South's lead may not be "honest"

if you play for 10 tricks, you could end up with 8, losing 2 spades, 2 hearts and 1 club

Tony

[pooltuna]

Old York, on Nov 1 2009, 12:44 PM, said:

pooltuna, on Nov 1 2009, 06:24 PM, said:

Perhaps you can suggest a defense that is setting this 3NT contract where the line for OTs makes a difference?

Give North ♠QJT9 ♥KJ(x) ♦xxx ♣Kxx

South's lead may not be "honest"

if you play for 10 tricks, you could end up with 8, losing 2 spades, 2 hearts and 1 club

Tony

Clearly you don't jeopardize the contract by taking a finesse if it means risking 9 tricks but you still set up the ♣♥ squeeze by ducking a ♠. You win the next ♠ lead and take the ♥ finesse because you expect it to win and leave you with a chance to try the ♣ finesse if both win you are now set to execute the squeeze.

[dellache]

Old York, on Nov 1 2009, 05:44 PM, said:

pooltuna, on Nov 1 2009, 06:24 PM, said:

Perhaps you can suggest a defense that is setting this 3NT contract where the line for OTs makes a difference?

Give North ♠QJT9 ♥KJ(x) ♦xxx ♣Kxx

South's lead may not be "honest"

if you play for 10 tricks, you could end up with 8, losing 2 spades, 2 hearts and 1 club.

By then I will have played ♥10, loses to Jack, back comes a Spade, and I play another Heart to the Queen. I now have my 9 tricks even if North takes my ♥Q (2♠2♥4♦1♣).

Even then I'll duck the Spade return, and take the next one. I'll cash ♥Ace, diamonds, ♥9. Now if North keeps his wining Spade, I play ♣A (thank you !). Otherwise, the finesse is now safe, and I will have done my max at IMPs.

[Old York]

pooltuna, on Nov 1 2009, 07:02 PM, said:

Clearly you don't jeopardize the contract by taking a finesse if it means risking 9 tricks....

.... unless you are playing matchpoints

Clearly, an overtrick is highly likely. The odds of a tenth trick are huge, but a rubber player would never play for 10 tricks on this hand, and many imp players would see the danger of a Spade switch, but probably "go with the odds"

I would treat this hand as an easy 9 tricks and get on with the next hand if an overtick failed to materialise with no assistance from defenders

Risking game for 1 Imp is a cardinal sin

Tony

[awm]

The contract is cold, even when we're messing around for the overtrick.

Say we play ♥T, loses to jack. Spade comes back, we duck, and another spade where we win ♠K. Now we play a heart to the queen, and this also loses to the king. A spade comes back, driving out the ace. At this point we cash the ♥A. Now we play four rounds of diamonds discarding a club from dummy. We cash the ♥9, which sets up a show-up squeeze against LHO if he holds both the ♣K and the long spade. In any case we have nine tricks (two spades, two hearts, four diamonds, the club ace). So there is no risk of going down in the contract.

In the more likely event that the opening leader has one of the heart honors, we have time to establish a club trick (for trick ten) and then we may have some squeeze chances for trick eleven as well.

[Old York]

awm, on Nov 1 2009, 08:06 PM, said:

The contract is cold, even when we're messing around for the overtrick..... In any case we have nine tricks (two spades, two hearts, four diamonds, the club ace). So there is no risk of going down in the contract.

The OP asked the question "What would your play be for the above contract?"

This implies playing the hand for 9 tricks to guard against any adverse distribution. Obviously this is not what OP intended, as he asks for an overtrick

Playing the hand for 10 tricks is not the same as playing the hand for 9 tricks and an overtrick (if it drops in your lap)

Sorry if this caused confusion

Tony

[bid_em_up]

The 100% line is to win the Ace of hearts, cross to a diamond honor, and take the club finesse.

At worst, you are scoring 2 spades, 1 heart, 4 diamonds and 2 clubs. Even if the club finesse loses, North cannot profitably continue hearts.

Then worry about making your overtricks.

(Not really sure how this is even a problem).

[Fluffy]

think again mate, ♥10 is 100% as well

[bid_em_up]

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