[jillybean]

Playing 2/1, stayman, transfers, texas.

1N:2♥
2♠:3♦

We have this defined as ♠/♦ gf, can this also be used as a cue in ♠'s? ie

1N:2♥
2♠:3♦
3♠:4♥ - slammish ♠'s, ♦ and ♥ control?

In addition, how do you play these sequences:
1N:2♥ 2♠:4N
1N:4♥ 4♠:4N

[andy_h]

Generally no you can't use 3♦ as an advanced cue in spades because that sort of assumes you know partner will definitely be bidding 3♠ over 3♦. If partner doesn't and bids 3NT and you remove that to 4x, that is generally natural most likely a fragment (patterning out) and slam try. The bidding after that may then get a bit murky which would definitely need discussion.

The 2nd auction you propose, I would still play that as patterning out. Now you may ask what to do with those 6+♠ that want to self agree trump suit and start a cue sequence. That may depend on your 1NT structure system, ie. what is 1NT-2♥-2♠-3♥? If that's non-existent then you can use this as self agreeing spades with slam interest (remember if partner doesn't bid 2♠ but does some form of superaccept you'll already be on your way to cuebidding). With one of my partners I play that sequence to show 5-5 Majors GF so we would need to bid 4♣ to initiate a cue bidding sequence.

As for the last 2 texas auctions, I think the 'standard' meaning is that when you texas, it's either a sign off or about to keycard. So that makes 1NT-4♥-4♠-4NT keycard in spades and 1NT-2♥-2♠-4NT as 5♠332 quantitative.

[jillybean]

We also play 1N-2♥-2♠-3♥ as 55 but

1N-2♥-2♠-4♣ is a splinter or as one partner likes to play, 4♣ here as keycard.

[P_Marlowe]

Hi,

yes, 3D in the seq. you gave could also be a cue for spades,
partner wont know this at the moment you make the bid, but
he will understand in the later round.
See your summary of the 4H bid, it should also deny a club
control, i.e. 5422.
The way the seq. developed, it is not clear, if 3D was intended
as a cue for spades, or if 3D was just showing a good 4 card
side suit, 3S showed the fit.

Since you play Texas, the first 4NT bid is quantitative with 5
spades, the 2nd is RKCB for spades.

With kind regards
Marlowe

[ONEferBRID]

1N:2♥
2♠:3♦ = standard is a 2nd suit ( usually 5 cds also ), not as a cue per se.
You can 't have it both ways. You will feel mighty silly if
partner raises Diam to game or slam with 5 cards and you only have A x.....
UNLESS you always use it a cue w/6+cards ... which I think is less useful than the standard treatment.

New suit "jumps" are self-splinters w/6+cards ( as has been mentioned ).

There was a very recent thread about these sequences which bore out the fact that "below game cuebidding" is unavailable after a simple-accepted transfer.

But wait awhile, I bet KenR is sitting on his back porch right now conjuring up a useful scheme. His Weak-2D open -- 2M Response treatment was brilliant ( see two good by jillybean ).

- - Don - -

[jillybean]

Thanks. Im getting bogged down at the moment with slam bidding; whats a splinter and whats gerber keycard, exclusion blackwood, minorwood, minimax gerber - nothing makes sense anymore.

[mike777]

jillybean, on Sep 10 2009, 07:05 AM, said:

Playing 2/1, stayman, transfers, texas.

1N:2♥
2♠:3♦


"natural and game force.."

We have this defined as ♠/♦ gf, can this also be used as a cue in ♠'s? ie





1N:2♥
2♠:3♦
3♠:4♥ - slammish ♠'s, ♦ and ♥ control?




"3s=agree spades...so 4h=cue bid with spades as trump"



In addition, how do you play these sequences:
1N:2♥ 2♠:4N


"quant...slam try in nt......"


1N:4♥ 4♠:4N




"rkc in spades...."

ok

[ONEferBRID]

Quote

There was a very recent thread about these sequences which bore out the fact that "below game cuebidding" is unavailable after a simple-accepted transfer.

I found that thread-- title: "Why didnt we bid the slam?" in the SAYC and 2/1 Discussion ...

Here was a reply in that thread:
by cherdanno @ Aug 30 2009, 01:49 PM....

Quote

Anyway, in US standard methods, you can't initiate cuebidding with one-suited hands without shortness - and I have to admit I can live with these inferior methods.

And here was the hand ( OP by Wackojack ):
Dealer: West
Vul: E/W
Scoring: IMP
♠ A7
♥ QJ96
♦ K62
♣ AQ97

♠ KQ10985
♥ AK5
♦ 98
♣ K4

1nt-2♥
2♠- 3♣
3NT- 4♠

....where he hoped the 3♣ bid would be interpreted as a cuebid for Sp
instead of the standard: " good 2nd 5cd suit ".

[texnorm]

1N:2♥ 2♠:4N
1N:4♥ 4♠:4N

your partner is a liar and you should pass. Then discuss the hand. Your partner has to be a Liar unless you open 1NT outside of range. If your partner actually has slam invitational or better points and 6+♠ he should bid 3♠. If you use Texas transfers and he bids 4♥ to your 4♠response it is a signoff. Texas should only be envoked with 6+Major suit and ~10Pts. Others may disagree but with the 3rd lvl Major open for a 6+Major and slam invitational points why use Texas for anything but a sign off?

[jillybean]

texnorm, on Sep 14 2009, 08:42 PM, said:

1N:2♥ 2♠:4N
1N:4♥ 4♠:4N

your partner is a liar and you should pass.  Then discuss the hand.  Your partner has to be a Liar unless you open 1NT outside of range.  If your partner actually has slam invitational or better points and 6+♠ he should bid 3♠.  If you use Texas transfers and he bids 4♥ to your 4♠response it is a signoff.  Texas should only be envoked with 6+Major suit and ~10Pts.  Others may disagree but with the 3rd lvl Major open for a 6+Major and slam invitational points why use Texas for anything but a sign off?

I'm conused as to who is bidding what here and who is the liar.
If partner "bids 4♥ to your 4♠response" we will be getting a visit from the friendly TD.

1N:2♥ 2♠:4N Quantitative
1N:4♥ 4♠ pass 6+ cards no slam interest
1N:4♥ 4♠:4N Keycard slam or grand?