[TheoKole]

With my regular partner we have a specific bid for this type of hand. 2 ♥ describes a hand with 5 hearts and a minor which can be longer. We use Multi 2 ♦ to describe a regular weak 2 bid in a major, or 2 NT opener or 4441 hand 16 -21 points.

Cheers,

Theo

[jdonn]

dake50, on Jun 15 2009, 01:03 AM, said:

How about 1S?  Hope I can escape to 2C/3C/4C.

LOL yes you will get out in 2♣, I guess your partner never has a game force with spade support when you have a 5 count with no spades!

Please show me how you will wriggle out when partner responds with jacoby 2NT (or whatever game-forcing spade raise you use)? Planning to pass it you say? And if RHO overcalls, when you pass guess what partner is going to do.

Or how about 1♠ (3♦) 4♦ (X), your turn...

[rbforster]

gnasher, on Jun 15 2009, 03:09 AM, said:

If a two-suited opening were available, would you make it?

I think I would. I sometimes play 2♣ as 5+ clubs and a 4+ major, weak 2 strength. That doesn't do perfect justice to this hand, but it clues partner in to my major and gives me some latitude if I later bid some unreasonable number of clubs.

[Hanoi5]

TheoKole, on Jun 15 2009, 11:19 AM, said:

With my regular partner we have a specific bid for this type of hand. 2 ♥ describes a hand with 5 hearts and a minor which can be longer. We use Multi 2 ♦ to describe a regular weak 2 bid in a major, or 2 NT opener or 4441 hand 16 -21 points.

Cheers,

Theo

I also gave a little thought to opening 2♥ (I have the same opening) but besides being Vulnerable, there were too many clubs. In another hand from the same set my partner played 4♠ down too many after opening 2♠ (same meaning but spades instead of hearts) with:

♠JTxxx
♥x
♦KQJT9x
♣x

So I don't think these hands should be a Muidenberg opening.

[hanp]

Muiderberg with 5-8 is very weird to me. Having said that, most other bids are weird as well. If you open 3C you are hopefully planning to bid again, but when the opponents get to 4S you cannot conveniently introduce hearts. 4C doesn't tell your story either and makes the chance that you can show hearts smaller. 5C with this is a bit disgusting but we are 5-8.

I wouldn't pass.

[the hog]

gnasher, on Jun 15 2009, 03:09 PM, said:

The_Hog, on Jun 15 2009, 03:27 AM, said:

No 2 suited opening I guess, so I'll pass.

If a two-suited opening were available, would you make it?

Yes. I know the shape is extreme, but i think the upside is worth it.
On reflection, Andy, with no 2 suited opening, I think i would probably bid 4C at the table rather than pass. Again, too much upside.

[jdonn]

I think opening 2♣ showing 5+ clubs and a 4+ major (as one poster wants to do) is reasonable, since when you later bid either suit and even take a third bit you are making a reasonable description of your relative lengths. You also get the far better and far longer off your chest at the start.

I do not at all like 2♥ showing 5 hearts and 5 or 4+ in a minor. I worry that bidding clubs too many times after that will show something more like 6-6, or may be interpreted as a stronger (and different) sort of hand if partner supports the major. Even worse, if the next player does something like overcall 4♠ then I am very nervous about bidding 5♣ when it comes back since it's a joke to think partner will choose the right suit, but I am even more nervous about never mentioning the clubs.

[jdonn]

cardsharp, on Jun 15 2009, 03:58 AM, said:

jdonn, on Jun 15 2009, 05:07 AM, said:

Just five losers and a five card major. 1♥ wtp?

It's done Steve Robinson no harm over the last week.

He has been opening 5 counts at the 1 level has he?

[xcurt]

jdonn, on Jun 15 2009, 08:36 PM, said:

cardsharp, on Jun 15 2009, 03:58 AM, said:

jdonn, on Jun 15 2009, 05:07 AM, said:

Just five losers and a five card major. 1♥ wtp?

It's done Steve Robinson no harm over the last week.

He has been opening 5 counts at the 1 level has he?

Steve moderates the D6 bidding forum, and about every other month there is a problem where you are asked what to do on round two, after you opened 1M on 5M-6m, or you opened at the 1-level on a 9-count, 2 controls, but 6 losers. The panel complains about the round one action, which gives Steve a chance to espouse his ideas about the value of the opening bid and the relative value of bidding a major over a minor.

I'm not sure Steve is correct, because a lot of this is about the implied odds. If you aren't getting better results when you hit your hand, but you are getting worse results when you miss your hand, then maybe you shouldn't be acting light/offshape. Then again, his team is USA1, right now, so...

On the actual hand, I would just bury the hearts and open 4♣. That gets about 90% of my hand across, which is more than any other later action would accomplish, and maximally preempts the opponents. Well, maybe not "maximally preempts," but 5♣ is just asking to hand over a big number of IMPs when we miss our hand. The opponents are going to drive us to the 5 level with their spades quite often anyway (and if we choose some lower action to start the hand, and partner doubles them out in 4♠, can we really sit anyway), so we are only going to want to play hearts when partner is specifically x5x1 without the ♣Q.

[dake50]

jdonn, Do you really think this is our hand? Psych when it is their hand. Take lumps when psych is wrong. That has always been the psych strategy. Disagree here yes. I was just suggesting a bent of mind. LOL was correct.

[Hanoi5]

Quote

Do you really think this is our hand?

This was the hand:

---

My team-mates played 6♠ and received a club lead. South passed the 8-5 and later came up with 3♣ over 2♠ (and North never supported clubs). I bid as previously explained and so didn't 'feel' the need to go to 6♣ (I was afraid they might reach 6 and I expected them to make it). Anyway 5♠ only had an overtrick for I led a small heart

6♥ or 7♣ can be made by N/S if they find the singleton ♥K.

[skjaeran]

Unless I had a weak opening showing a major-minor 2-suiter with longer minor, I'd never use a 2-suited opening bid with this hand. It distorts too much, IMO.

I guess I'd just open 4♣ and await further development.