[jillybean]

Dealer: East Vul: NS Scoring: IMP

♠ J96 ♥ KT ♦ KJ83 ♣ AQ64

West North East South

 -     -     1♠    ?

You are south 2nd seat - East opens 1♠

[Mbodell]

I pass, but I'm guessing that some might try 1NT or X or 2♣.

[hrothgar]

Pass

Without a second thought

[mtvesuvius]

Pass. Why would I bid? lol

[gwnn]

I once bid 1NT on a hand much like this, but with an extra ace. With this one pass is quite clear.

[jdonn]

I should say the reason everyone will find pass so easy is not that it's desirable since it's not. It's just that this is a common problem we have all come across many times, so we know to pass without going through the thought process.

[jillybean]

jdonn, on Apr 12 2009, 02:33 PM, said:

I should say the reason everyone will find pass so easy is not that it's desirable since it's not. It's just that this is a common problem we have all come across many times, so we know to pass without going through the thought process.

Its the thought process I'm most interested in
Its taken me a long time to get to the point where Im happy passing with this sort of hand, whenever I have points I've thought I must bid.

[gwnn]

You have shortness in the unbid major so you can't double. Basically this is the thought process.

[jillybean]

delete

[jdonn]

I don't know why you snapped at him, what he said is exactly right. There really isn't anything more to it other than to note you only make an exception with extra values.

[jillybean]

You’re right and I removed my response immediately after posting it.

[Winstonm]

Quote

I should say the reason everyone will find pass so easy is not that it's desirable since it's not.

If pass is not desirable why don't we bid?

[mtvesuvius]

Winstonm, on Apr 12 2009, 06:47 PM, said:

Quote

I should say the reason everyone will find pass so easy is not that it's desirable since it's not.

If pass is not desirable why don't we bid?

What bid do you suggest?

Pass is the least of evils.

Double: We only have 2♥, so this is ruled out.
1NT: We are light, and have no ♠ stopper.
2♣: To bid a 4 card suit is suicide imo. Picture LHO with 7♣ to the KJ... OOPS. Not only that, but your ♣ suit isn't even that good.
2♦: See 2♣.
Anything Else: Anything else is insane.
This leaves pass.

[Winstonm]

mtvesuvius, on Apr 12 2009, 06:57 PM, said:

Winstonm, on Apr 12 2009, 06:47 PM, said:

Quote

I should say the reason everyone will find pass so easy is not that it's desirable since it's not.

If pass is not desirable why don't we bid?

What bid do you suggest?

Pass is the least of evils.

Double: We only have 2♥, so this is ruled out.
1NT: We are light, and have no ♠ stopper.
2♣: To bid a 4 card suit is suicide imo. Picture LHO with 7♣ to the KJ... OOPS. Not only that, but your ♣ suit isn't even that good.
2♦: See 2♣.
Anything Else: Anything else is insane.
This leaves pass.

I wasn't the one who said pass wasn't desirable.

Quote

jdonn Posted: Apr 12 2009, 04:33 PM 
I should say the reason everyone will find pass so easy is not that it's desirable since it's not.

[jdonn]

Pass is definitely not desirable. What I mean by that is if double showed 13-15 balanced without implying support for hearts, I would be very happy to double (whereas if you change the AQ of clubs into small clubs I would not want to double even if it showed a balanced 7-9).

Anyway your question was a bit silly imo. You pass even though it's not desirable because the available alternatives are even worse.

[xcurt]

jdonn, on Apr 12 2009, 07:36 PM, said:

You pass even though it's not desirable because the available alternatives are even worse.

There's another part to the thought process that hasn't been mentioned. That part is that the auction is a cooperative process with partner. If 1♠ rides around to partner he/she should be aware that you can easily hold a weak NT without heart length on this auction, and act accordingly.

[neilkaz]

This becomes an easy hand if you ask yourself what do you do when you double and PD bids ♥ at any level since he'll assume that you have 4 card support and will expect at least good 3 card support.

You have only 14 HCP and ♠ aren't really stopped so 1NT is really light here.

That being said, passing isn't desirable here. I'll admit to overcalling at the 2m level sometimes with a 4 card suit with 100 honors or AKJ9 min with this point count and no other bid, but here you simply have to pass.

If PD criticizes, tell him to read about take out doubles and also how to learn to balance if he should have.

PASS .. neilkaz ..

[JLOL]

You could definitely miss game by passing, but you just have no bid.

[Winstonm]

jdonn, on Apr 12 2009, 07:36 PM, said:

Pass is definitely not desirable. What I mean by that is if double showed 13-15 balanced without implying support for hearts, I would be very happy to double (whereas if you change the AQ of clubs into small clubs I would not want to double even if it showed a balanced 7-9).

Anyway your question was a bit silly imo. You pass even though it's not desirable because the available alternatives are even worse.

If pass is truly not desirable, then the question is how important is it to bid this hand - should we change the meaning of double or 1NT to accommodate this hand? If we are unwilling to sacrifice the meaning of any other bid to accomodate this hand, then we don't really have that strong of desire to compete.

If the answer is only: all actions are worse, then pass is the best bid and thus it is the desired action.

[Echognome]

Winstonm, on Apr 13 2009, 03:46 PM, said:

jdonn, on Apr 12 2009, 07:36 PM, said:

Pass is definitely not desirable. What I mean by that is if double showed 13-15 balanced without implying support for hearts, I would be very happy to double (whereas if you change the AQ of clubs into small clubs I would not want to double even if it showed a balanced 7-9).

Anyway your question was a bit silly imo. You pass even though it's not desirable because the available alternatives are even worse.

If pass is truly not desirable, then the question is how important is it to bid this hand - should we change the meaning of double or 1NT to accommodate this hand? If we are unwilling to sacrifice the meaning of any other bid to accomodate this hand, then we don't really have that strong of desire to compete.

If the answer is only: all actions are worse, then pass is the best bid and thus it is the desired action.

I have to say that this sounds like an awful lot of semantics.