[mikes616]

we play 2 over one ( game forcing) and 1NT forcing; my partner opened with 1D; I am sitting with 20 hcp, 1D, 4C, 4H, 4S and open with 2C showing a MINIMUM opening hand ( and no fit with diamonds). My partner responds 2NT. I assume that she DID NOT have anoter 4 card suit to bid. We wound up at 4H and missed the slam ( I made a grand slam). She defended her bid ( she had 14 tcp) stating that I should have jumped shift rather than do the 2 over 1. I argued that my bid was fine and further, by her bidding 2NT she denied having 4 hearts which, in turn, messed up my bid. Who is correct???...Let me clarify a bit......My hand had all 4 aces plus 4 other points. The bidding went 1D, 2C, 2NT, 3H, 4H. I was afraid of a notrump contract with my singleton Ace , I couldn't depend on the reliability of her diamonds because of the better minor bid and my 3♥ bid was a desperate attempt to find some kind of suit contract.

[Hanoi5]

Add the hands and explain a little better.

[hotShot]

I don't get the problem, over your partners 2NT, you know you don't have a fit and you know that your side has 20 + your partners opening = 32+ HCP.
The only thing that could keep you from bidding 6NT at once, would be to make sure your side is not missing 2 keycards.

[P_Marlowe]

Hi,

From your post:

You are in 3rd seat holding a hand with
a 4-4-1-4 shape and 20HCP.

The auction develops as followes

1D (1) - 2C (2)
2NT (3) - ... 4H (4)

(1) SAYC or 2/1 style
(2) game forcing
(3) bal. most likely showing also a min opener?
(4) end contract

A few comments

#0 There is no huge difference between SAYC and 2/1,
if the bidding starts with an opening in a minor
Of course you can add. conventional stuff after the
bidding begun with
1D - 2C
...

#1 your correct response is 1H, you only bid 2C,
if clubs are your longest suit

#2 For most, 2H over 2C would show reverse strength,
or at least add. strength and a 5-4 shape
In other words: 2NT usually does not deny a four
card major
If you have 5 clubs and 4 hearts, over 2NT you bid
3H, showing game forcing strength with 5-4

#4 Most likely there was still a way to reach the 6 level,
but since you did not give the complete seq., it is hard
to comment.

So all in all: Both of you were wrong.
- you did go wrong in the bidding
- your partners suggestion, that you should have make
a jump shift to show the game forcing strength is also
wrong.

Second: You should not try to focus on, who is to blame,
but you should try to discuss with partner, where it would
have been possible to do better.

With kind regards
Marlowe

[neilkaz]

It helps greatly to see the hands and the entire auction, but for now, I have to ask why did you respond 2♣ on a 4 card suit when you have a normal forcing 1♥ bid available showing that 4 card suit ?

[mikes616]

I responded 2♣ rather than 1♥ in order to show an opening hand+ and game forcing which I thought would be an expedient bid. I thought we could arrive at a suit contract later. Maybe a poor choice? I also thought that Aces and spaces could pose a problem especially with the 2NT response.

[P_Marlowe]

mikes616, on Feb 24 2009, 09:01 AM, said:

I responded 2♣ rather than 1♥ in order to show an opening hand+ and game forcing which I thought would be an expedient bid.  I thought we could arrive at a suit contract later.  Maybe a poor choice?  I also thought that Aces and spaces could pose a problem especially with the 2NT response.

Hi,

Not necessarrily a poor choice, but not standard.

The problem with 2C is, that you kill a complete level,
another one is, that auctions starting with

1D - 2C

are not easy, you will find lots of thread discussing hands
and bidding seq., which start in this fashion.
And due to the lack of a forcing NT response, lots of peoble
play is not 100% game forcing, but there are also lots of
peoble who play it.

In general a good strategy for responder is trying to keep
the bidding low, giving opener max. room to describe his
hand.

With kind regards
Marlowe

PS: Aces and Spaces is a terrible slogan.
Aces are brilliant cards, they get usually undervalued, i.e. be
happy, if you have a hand with Aces.

[Apollo81]

For future reference, you may want to format posts like this:

<vulnerability>, <form of scoring>

♠<spade holding>
♥<heart holding>
♦<diamond holding>
♣<club holding>

<auction>

<your question>

[Apollo81]

When partner opens 1 of a minor and you hold a 4-card major, you should respond 1 of the major unless

A- you can force game AND
B- you have 5+ cards in the other minor

or

C- you qualify for a strong jump shift

If A and B are true, you should respond in the other minor and then bid the major at your next turn.

In this case, the above didn't apply, so you should have responded 1♥. Remember that a new suit response to 1 of a suit is forcing for one round. Thus you can bid as such with very strong hands as well as with 6-counts.