[sheilafran]

Does anyone know if you can play smolen after interference by opps ie

1NT (P) 2C (2D)
P (p) 2S ... is this now SMOLEN??

or would suggest it is by partnership agreement?

Thanks

[Fluffy]

I tend to forget about any convention whenever any non double intervention happens (an even some double interventions, like 1NT-X)

on your example, any suit bid on that position would mean 5 cards to me.

This is part of our meta-agreements, since you cannot account every situation when oppoennts overcall, you need some clear meta-agreements with your partner to understand each other when the situation arises.

[helene_t]

Smolen would be a 3♠ bid showing five hearts. Here it is whatever 2♠ would have shown if opener had responded 2♦. I think standard is weak, but some play it as invitational. In either case, 5+ spades.

[lexlogan]

As Helene said, of course, Smolen is a jump to 3 of a major after opener replies 2D to Stayman. So 2S is unaffected by the overcall -- it is natural and either weak or invitational (or perhaps artificial). What would 3S be? The question points out a big disadvantage to the casual adoption of gadget bids -- 3S might promise 5 hearts because, of course, the logic of Smolen still applies; or it might promise 5 spades because, of course, gadgets meant for constructive bidding do not generally apply over competition. The result is that you do not and cannot know what partner will think, therefore you may have to settle for 3NT at this point and discuss it with partner later. Were you not playing Smolen you would simply jump in your five card major, game-forcing with no ambiguity.

I would recommend that Smolen, like Texas transfers, be on in competition as long as they are still jump bids, but these should be recognized as a specific exceptions to the general rule that artificial gadgets do not apply in competition.

[Winstonm]

Quote

Smolen is a jump to 3 of a major after opener replies 2D to Stayman.

I must respectfully disagree with this statement. The Smolen convention is a method of bidding one 4-card major when holding 5 of the other major, after a Stayman inquiry and 2D response, in order to uncover a 5/3 major suit fit.

The fact that original Smolen took place at the 3-level isn't important - it's is the concept of bidding the 4-card major when 54 that is important.

If you want this 2S bid to be Smolen by agreement, then it can be Smolen - or a Smolen-like bid.

Myself, I like to play Smolen as a 1-round force and use it in uncontested auctions at the 2-level. 1n-2c-2d-2h/s is Smolen, 1-round force, in my methods.

Maybe technically, it shouldn't be Smolen but I would rather give credit to the originator of the concept than worry about tiny details.

[ASkolnick]

I actually play "smolen" at the two level as well with some partnerships.

[Trinidad]

Winstonm, on Dec 8 2008, 06:40 PM, said:

Quote

Smolen is a jump to 3 of a major after opener replies 2D to Stayman.

I must respectfully disagree with this statement. The Smolen convention is a method of bidding one 4-card major when holding 5 of the other major, after a Stayman inquiry and 2D response, in order to uncover a 5/3 major suit fit.

The fact that original Smolen took place at the 3-level isn't important - it's is the concept of bidding the 4-card major when 54 that is important.

If you want this 2S bid to be Smolen by agreement, then it can be Smolen - or a Smolen-like bid.

Myself, I like to play Smolen as a 1-round force and use it in uncontested auctions at the 2-level. 1n-2c-2d-2h/s is Smolen, 1-round force, in my methods.

Maybe technically, it shouldn't be Smolen but I would rather give credit to the originator of the concept than worry about tiny details.

I strongly agree with Winston.

Most certainly, 1NT-2♣; 2♦-2♠ can be Smolen: invitational (or even invitational or better) with 4 spades and 5(+) hearts.

In fact, I think that this form of Smolen makes more sense than the GF Smolen version at the three level. With the modern 1NT opening being something like 14+ to 17- (instead of 16-18), the responder needs a decent 10 point hand to force to game without a known fit. That means that the strength difference between the 1NT opener and responder is rather small: A maximum of 6 or 7 HCPs, typically 2-4 HCPs, but the difference could even be negative. In invitational Smolen, the difference between the hands is bigger: The 1NT opener has about 7-9 HCPs more than the responder.

So, there is not much reason to "make the strong hand declarer" since "the strong hand" is not much stronger than the weak hand. Since this is the main advantage of GF Smolen, we should look at the drawbacks:

- GF Smolen makes the best known hand declarer in a 4M contract (Balanced, 14+ to 17-, no four card major, 3 trumps). This makes life easy for the defenders. If you don't play GF Smolen at all, responder will be declaring and usually less is known about this hand (9-15, 4 cards in the other major, 5+ trumps).

- GF Smolen takes the symmetry out of major suit slam auctions. After 1NT-2♣; 2♦-3♥, you have 5 bids to show 3 card spade support (3♠, 4♣, 4♦, 4♥, 4♠). After 1NT-2♣; 2♦-3♠, you have only 3 bids to show 3 card heart support (4♣, 4♦, 4♥). Suppose that you use good old fashioned standard cuebidding, then in the heart auctions, you cannot cuebid spades below 4♥. In the spade auctions you can cuebid all suits and have one bid left over. This means that the spade auctions will carry meanings that are different from the heart auctions. Why would you want to complicate your system like that?

For me any of these two drawbacks is good enough to forget about GF Smolen.

For invitational Smolen this is different. The second drawback (slam auction problems) obviously doesn't exist in invitational only Smolen. (And in invitational or better Smolen, there is more bidding room, so the difference in bidding room is not so important.) The first drawback (too much is known about declarer's hand) also exists in invitational Smolen, but that drawback is smaller. After all, if responder would be declaring (as in standard Stayman), it would be known to the defense that he has an invitational hand with about 8-9 HCPs. In other words, the Smolen drawback is not really bigger than the drawback in the standard auction. On the other hand, the advantage of playing invitational Smolen (making the strong hand declarer) is actually significant.

In short: Playing GF Smolen comes with substantial drawbacks and a rather insignificant advantage over standard Stayman. Playing invitational Smolen comes with little drawbacks (other than the one below) and substantial advantages over standard Stayman.

The reason why I don't play invitational Smolen is that I think that there are even better ways to play (while remaining in a 'Stayman and transfers' context) and they cannot be combined easily with the invitational Smolen concept.

Rik