[Aberlour10]

wow, here are already enough potential members for establishing of the SLPWC,
Social-Liberal Party of Water Cooler

Robert

[gwnn]

When you are troubled, it's better not to think about it, but to keep busy with more cheerful things.

Economic Left/Right: -4.12
Social Libertarian/Authoritarian: -2.05

BTW the website doesn't think Romania or Bulgaria are in the EU.

[helene_t]

gwnn, on Nov 13 2008, 05:55 PM, said:

When you are troubled, it's better not to think about it, but to keep busy with more cheerful things.

I agree with that one. Dunno if it makes me left or right or whatever. I have a vague thought that it's a liberalist POV but not sure it makes much sense.

[cherdano]

helene_t, on Nov 13 2008, 09:22 AM, said:

The site displays a very strong correlation between authoritarian and right-winged. But everyone perceive himself as pro-freedom.

I wonder if this is really so. Or if it reflects that the authors of the site are libertanian/leftwinged.

I think they just don't have a clue. The justifications for some of their weird questions in their FAQ sound...even weirder, or at the very least extremely unprofessional.

[matmat]

I think this sort of questionaire is difficult to design. The questions have to often be non-obvious to the person taking the test, so as to not invoke the following thought process:

"this question is trying to gauge how I feel about X"
"I want others to think that I lean left in regard to X"
"which answer best suits that conclusion?"
"oh. ok. this one. click"

[Gerben42]

Quote

Economic Left/Right: -1.00
Social Libertarian/Authoritarian: -3.74

Very few "famous" people in this area. Also no political parties. Strangely enough I'm closest to the Green party on this chart, but when I take the test about the actual issues for the latest German election, I got the liberals by a mile.

But... I don't have a vote for Germany's national elections anyway (only local), and I cannot vote for a party that thinks nuclear power is a bad idea, thus endangering my job.

[NickRW]

helene_t, on Nov 13 2008, 12:33 PM, said:

Analytical/creative: I was surprised to be judged rather extreme to the "creative" side, unlike most computer nerds. I must have some undiscovered talents.

Some computer people (often the better ones IMO) are indeed quite creative - not the typical nerdy type at all.

Nick

[helene_t]

When they place the European political parties, they generally put the socialists and greenees more towards "libertarian" than the liberal parties. This is strange IMHO because I personally believe in social justice but nevertheless tend to vote liberal because freedom is important to me and I think the socialists and greenees are generally autoritarian.

When I read the texts on the site I get the idea that their reasoning is that a free market defeats social justice and thereby defeats freedom for the poor. Or something like that. I beg to differ.

[NickRW]

-1.38/-1.85 - which puts me roughly where they suppose the British Labour party was in 1982 - yuck. Either I don't know my own views as well as I think or this test is a load of junk.

Nick

[mikeh]

cherdano, on Nov 12 2008, 11:34 PM, said:

Yeah a lot of questions are very weird:
economic left/right: -2.88
social libertarian/authoritarian: -7.03

I didn't realize I am an anarchist.

We appear to be soul-brothers

I was -2.38/-6.21

[cherdano]

helene_t, on Nov 13 2008, 05:06 PM, said:

When they place the European political parties, they generally put the socialists and greenees more towards "libertarian" than the liberal parties. This is strange IMHO because I personally believe in social justice but nevertheless tend to vote liberal because freedom is important to me and I think the socialists and greenees are generally autoritarian.

It is fair to consider the German Green party as libertarian (in their strange authoritarian/libertarian scale), and more libertarian than any other German party. They oppose making wiretaps for the police easier (more generally are always on the side of individual liberties versus expanding police power), are in favor easier paths to citizenships for immigrants, for transparency in government. They differ a lot to the social democrats which would be rather high up on the Authoritarian scale (well, from my perspective at least...)

[Elianna]

helene_t, on Nov 13 2008, 04:33 AM, said:

Left/Right: 1.25. So next to Elianna, Jimmy and I are the most right-winged here so far.

At least you have company!

I'm still alone in my quadrant.

[helene_t]

Thanks Arend, I realize I don't know much about German politics. BTW the Dutch Green party is also quite liberal on the issues you mention. I should probably have limited my rant to socialists and not included the green parties.

[MickyB]

I just gave the test to my housemate, who is possibly the most right-wing person I know. He scored -1.5, -0.15

[jikl]

Economic Left/Right: -4.62
Social Libertarian/Authoritarian: -5.64

Sean

[P_Marlowe]

Currently the German Liberals are trying moving back to
their "Liberal" roots, but between 1982-1998 they were
heavily focused on ecomics.

They still had "real" Liberal in their party, but most of the
time those got overruled.
I would have put them in the bottom right corner.

In my opinion, it is no coincidence that the Green party
got created in the early 80s, I dont know for sure, just
guessing, but I think that lots of peoble belonging to the
left wing of the Liberals joined the Greens at this time.

With kind regards
Marlowe

[helene_t]

MickyB, on Nov 14 2008, 03:06 AM, said:

I just gave the test to my housemate, who is possibly the most right-wing person I know. He scored -1.5, -0.15

Yes, I think this site has an agenda. Convince everyone that he/she is to the "left" (whatever that means) of all politicians with the possible exception of Nelson Mandela.

[helene_t]

Another American/European terminology issue:

"Social issues" seems to be the American term for what I would call "traditional values vs personal freedom". This is not much of a left/right issue in Europe or at least those countries with which I am familiar. When it comes to gay marriage, for example, you will find both traditionals and liberals in most parties. Those parties who are strongly traditional (Christian Union in the Netherlands, Christian Dems in Denmark) or strongly liberal (D66 in the Netherlands, RV in Denmark) are both considered centrist on the left-right scale. Thanks Arend for pointing me to the fact that the Green party in Germany (which rates as left) is liberal on such issues.

In European terminology, "social issues" relate to "socialist" or "social democrats" and are about downwards redistribution of wealth. Government departments of "social welfare" or "social affairs" deal with related policies.

I concede that there is a trend towards aligning individual freedom with downwards redistribution of wealth, especially in countries where the electoral system favors big parties so the right has become monopolized by conservatives, and liberals (such as myself and presumably Elianna) have become politically homeless. Nevertheless, I think few would consider individual freedom as defining for the left.

[TimG]

helene_t, on Nov 14 2008, 05:22 AM, said:

MickyB, on Nov 14 2008, 03:06 AM, said:

I just gave the test to my housemate, who is possibly the most right-wing person I know. He scored -1.5, -0.15

Yes, I think this site has an agenda. Convince everyone that he/she is to the "left" (whatever that means) of all politicians with the possible exception of Nelson Mandela.

I think it is a matter of degree. One of the early statements was:

"I'd always support my country, whether it was right or wrong."

I suspect that many people "strongly disagreed" with this statement. But, I also suspect that there aren't many people doing much about it when they are in disagreement with their country's policies. We may spout off in the water cooler or express our opinion at the ballot box, but I doubt many of us are actively involved in getting policy changed.

"Possessing marijuana for personal use should not be a criminal offence."

We may feel strongly about this, but again, I doubt any of us feels this is an issue of vital importance, or one that would get us out to knock on doors.

I live in Maine where there have been three referenda regarding gay rights in the last decade or so. This is an issue I feel strongly about, but the most I have done (besides vote) is make a contribution.

In short, I think it's easy to strongly agree or disagree with statements even if the issues are not important enough to us to move us away from our keyboards.

The political compass questionnaire would be much more interesting if the options were: "I have taken action against this", "I have voted against this", "I have done nothing", "I have voted in support this", and "I have taken action in support of this". I suspect strongly that we'd all be closer to the center.

[helene_t]

Yes. The only politically correct things I have done during the last year is to spend two hours collecting signatures for more money to bicycle bridges.

Put me two hours of work to the right of the center (as the alternative use of the money was some welfare project).

Anyway, I am not quite sure what they are trying to measure. If I am pro choice it may be because I think the World is overcrowded, or because I think it would be better for most of the children in question not to be born. It could also be that I think abortion is generally immoral but that I don't trust political or judicial authorities to make the decision on the woman's behalf. Or that I don't see it as a moral issue at all. Or that I just weigh the concern for the woman higher, or that I think a ban on abortion in infeasible. There is a lot of difference wrt core values which you don't capture by asking me about abortion in simple yes/no terms.

And then my pet peeve: "It is natural for children to lye to their parents". This is partly a semantic issue (what does "natural" mean?) and partly an issue of factual belief. But even the more meaningful "good parents sometimes spank their children" is not the same as "good governments sometimes spank their citizens". True, you can be consistently authoritarian and answer "yes" to both questions, but some will believe in governments' authority without believing in parents' authority or vice versa. Is it interesting when everything gets cooked down to one "authoritarian" scale? Maybe, but they have to add apples to oranges on some arbitrary scale.