[manudude03]

Scoring: MP

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Playing weak NT, 4cM (M before m), you open 1 spade and the auction continues (opps silent):

1♠-2♦
2♥-4♠

Is this hand worth a slam try, and if so, how to investigate?

EDIT for those asking about 4♠, it is merely "to play" (weaker than 3♠, not a picture bid so 12-15-)

[Cascade]

What did 4♠ show.

I normally play that 3♠ is forcing after a 2/1 and 4♠ would show a hand with no control outside spades and diamonds and fairly minimum. That hand would make slam possible since it suggests good spades since I have good diamonds.

With a fit for diamonds I would make a slam try even if 4♠ was just any game going hand.

5♣ cue seems normal for me. Then after the anticipated 5♦ 5♥ and partner will suspect i need something good in trumps.

[effervesce]

5♦ for me-much more helpful than a 5♣ bid for partner IMO unless you play this denies a club control (5♠ is available for asking for a club control). We play cues in own suit to show two of the top three honors.

If partner cuebids 5♥ I bid slam. If partner bids 5♠ I pass.

[kenrexford]

I have no idea what this Responder meant by 4♠. That makes it hard to decide what to do. The meaning I would assume is impossible, because I am looking at the AQ in diamonds. So, I am at a loss.

[jdonn]

Given this definition, I bid cuebid, either 5♣ or 5♦ depending on style and principles. Of course the methods are absolutely horrible, but my answer is simply what I think is most likely to be best given these methods.

[manudude03]

Scoring: MP

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1♠-2♦
2♥-4♠
5♠-6♠

Made 7 comfortably enough after spades split 2-1. Strangely the only pair in it (don't ask).

[matmat]

manudude03, on Oct 20 2008, 07:25 PM, said:

Scoring: MP

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1♠-2♦
2♥-4♠
5♠-6♠

Made 7 comfortably enough after spades split 2-1. Strangely the only pair in it (don't ask).

so noone splintered in hearts?

[kenrexford]

1♠-2♦
2♥-2♠
-?

O: 2NT(poor trumps)
R: 3♠ (no club control, not two of the top three diamonds, none of the top three hearts, but two of the top three spades)
O: 3NT (Serious Interest)
R: 4♦ (no tertiary club control, one of the top three diamonds)

At this point, Opener knows that Responder has at least three clubs without the Ace, King, or Queen. Opener knows that Responder has at worst KQ in spades. Opener knows that Responder has the diamond King. That's 8 HCP's. Add in the diamond Jack, and 9. Add in the club Jack and heart Jack, and 11 HCP. Make this GF, and Responder must have at least AQ and probably AK in spades. This is a huge favorite to bid further, considering that Responder has at most two hearts, as well.

[ArtK78]

This hand would be so much easier to bid if responder made the obvious splinter raise. Even playing 4-card majors the responding hand is a splinter bid.

[mikeh]

manudude03, on Oct 20 2008, 07:25 PM, said:

Scoring: MP

---

1♠-2♦
2♥-4♠
5♠-6♠

Made 7 comfortably enough after spades split 2-1. Strangely the only pair in it (don't ask).

Put this in a good field, and the entire field will be in at least 6♠... a few may have the ability to diagnose the 13 tricks available on a 2-1 trump break, but I think most would settle for slam.

I cannot imagine not splintering with the responding hand, over which opener has gold.

And even if I were asked to fill in for the 2♦ bidder, to jump to 4♠ over 2♥ is stunningly bad. Surely, if opener has any slam interest over my forcing 3♠, I am delighted... consider that opener has weak trumps.. if he is still slamming, I have a much better hand than the point count suggests.

My advice for the entire field: learn better hand evaluation. For either hand to consider these hands to be minimums, once a fit is established, is woeful.

[manudude03]

In a good field, I really would be annoyed to not be in slam. And yes the majority of the players really need to improve their evaluation. It seems fair to say that too many of them cling on to HCP and don't think too much about everything else (and I believe, but far from sure that some auctions had started 1♠-3♠!!!!). The quick conversation that occured after the hand summed it up quite nicely:

Partner: What was your count partner?
Me: Eleven.
**partner chuckles**
LHO: There's no way anyone else is going to be in it.
Me: I wouldn't be so sure.....
LHO: But you don't even have game points....

The rest of the conversation basically focussed on what 5♠ meant.

When I finally checked the results yesterday, not only were we the only pair in slam, it seems one pair stopped in 2♠ somehow....

That's enough criticising the rest of the club though, whole point of the topic was on how to evaluate my hand after 4♠ (I suppose a slightly more interesting exercise would be how to bid the slam if LHO overcalls 3♣)

ps. kenrexford, you have an insufficient bid in your sequence.

[jdeegan]

Pass
You have 11 HCP and partner has opted for fast arrival showing spades (enuf to play) and diamonds (good for ur hand). Too much can be very wrong to risk the five level imho. On the hand given, partner misbid horribly. A Jacoby 2NT or a 4♥ splinter would have been far superior to the wishy washy 2♦ - ugh!

Consider the reasonable auctions after 2NT. You bid 3♣ (shortness). Pard bid 3♥ (the ace). You bid 3♠ (forcing). Pard bid 4♦ (the king). You bid 5♠ (asking for trumps). Pard bids 6♠.

Over 4♥, bid 5♠. Pard bids 6♠. Count tricks, Bubba. Five or six ♠, the ace of ♥. Three ♥ ruffs (pard shows 4 ♠). All pard needs is the ♦ king or the ♣ ace plus no ♠ loser. Almost any 12 HCP with 4♠ and a stiff ♥ will do.