[hrothgar]

I thought that the following hand was probably the most interesting over the weekend

The auction starts

MPS

You hold

♠ K64
♥ QJ75
♦ T2
♣ Q632

(P) - 1♠ - (3♠) - ???

3♠ asks for a Spade stopper

Question 1: What would a double show?
Question 2: Assume that you passed (I did)

LHO bids 3N which becomes the final contract
Partner leads the King of Clubs.
You encourage, he cashes the club Ace and then a Club to your Queen

What do you do now that you are in?

[rogerclee]

I would have doubled. As far as what I do, I would need to see dummy.

[TimG]

rogerclee, on Oct 13 2008, 12:12 PM, said:

I would have doubled. As far as what I do, I would need to see dummy.

Demanding of you!

♠3 ♥93 ♦AKQJ8754 ♣54

[rogerclee]

TimG, on Oct 13 2008, 10:16 AM, said:

rogerclee, on Oct 13 2008, 12:12 PM, said:

I would have doubled. As far as what I do, I would need to see dummy.

Demanding of you!

♠3 ♥93 ♦AKQJ8754 ♣54

I think the ♥Q needs the least from partner.

[gnasher]

Double shows a reasonable hand that would have raised spades. I suppose this qualifies, though it's a bit lacking in offensive values.

Is that dummy normal for this action? Where I come from he'd have stops in the rounded suits as well as solidish diamonds.

We need partner to have the ace of one of the majors. He has more cards in spades than in hearts, and is more likely to have considered Axxxx xxxx x AKx worth an opening than xxxxx Axxx x AKx. I play a spade.

[itinerant]

didn't parter lead the CK? i switch a heart if i trust him

[P_Marlowe]

#1 x, showing values in the suit.

With kind regards
Marlowe

[lilboyman]

I am no expert but would think that what the X meant would depend on your agreements.

Question: Staring at eight tricks in dummy wouldn't an expert cash one or both of his Aces if he held them before leading the 3rd club?

[barmar]

lilboyman, on Oct 15 2008, 03:13 PM, said:

Question: Staring at eight tricks in dummy wouldn't an expert cash one or both of his Aces if he held them before leading the 3rd club?

Thus setting up declarer's king and handing him the contract, unless your clubs are QJxx or Qxxxx.

[pclayton]

lilboyman, on Oct 15 2008, 11:13 AM, said:

Question: Staring at eight tricks in dummy wouldn't an expert cash one or both of his Aces if he held them before leading the 3rd club?

If pard has both aces, then he doesn't care what we continue at T4.

Quote

I am no expert

JT, nice to have you back!

[barmar]

barmar, on Oct 15 2008, 03:54 PM, said:

lilboyman, on Oct 15 2008, 03:13 PM, said:

Question: Staring at eight tricks in dummy wouldn't an expert cash one or both of his Aces if he held them before leading the 3rd club?

Thus setting up declarer's king and handing him the contract, unless your clubs are QJxx or Qxxxx.

I think I responded too quickly. Maybe that's not the problem. This is MP, so perhaps we're just trying to prevent overtricks, not set the contract. If declarer has two tricks in his hand, he'll make an overtrick if partner doesn't have QJ to go with your A.

At IMPs you have to assume that partner has what you need to set the contract. But at MPs you go with the odds. You can't risk that partner will exit with the wrong suit.

[TimG]

It might be of consideration that if dummy had made a normal 4D overcall and bought it there, he would be down one (8 diamonds plus dummy's major suit ace). 3NT could be down two if the correct major is returned.

At IMPs, it is surely right to cash an Ace at trick two and play to partner's ♣Q assuring four clubs plus the ace. But, at MP, it might be right to put partner on lead to play a major. (And, if partner has ♣Qxx, opening leader could look silly by "cashing" the ♣J.)

[barmar]

TimG, on Oct 15 2008, 06:26 PM, said:

At IMPs, it is surely right to cash an Ace at trick two and play to partner's ♣Q assuring four clubs plus the ace.

How are we getting 4 clubs? We're getting the AKQ, but declarer's Jxxx stops the suit.

[TimG]

barmar, on Oct 15 2008, 05:34 PM, said:

TimG, on Oct 15 2008, 06:26 PM, said:

At IMPs, it is surely right to cash an Ace at trick two and play to partner's ♣Q assuring four clubs plus the ace.

How are we getting 4 clubs? We're getting the AKQ, but declarer's Jxxx stops the suit.

Opening leader had AKJx.

[lilboyman]

QUOTE (lilboyman @ Oct 15 2008, 11:13 AM)
Question: Staring at eight tricks in dummy wouldn't an expert cash one or both of his Aces if he held them before leading the 3rd club?


[QUOTE]If pard has both aces, then he doesn't care what we continue at T4.

The point of my question is why would an expert make me guess which Ace he holds after I take my Club Q and 4th Club, if held.

If he holds the Ace of Spades, and cashes before leading the 3rd Club, I will know to cash the King of Spades. If he holds the Ace of Hearts and not the Spade Ace and cashes before leading the third Club I would be able to cash the King of Hearts if held. If I don't hold either King we can't set the contract and want to hold the contract to the least number of tricks. Assuming, of course, declarer is not void in Diamonds. If declarer has either Ace he has 9 fast tricks if his Spade stopper is solid. I would therefore assume either both or neither of the major suit Aces are held by partner and lead a low Spade hoping partner has the AJ10.

[gnasher]

lilboyman, on Oct 16 2008, 04:28 AM, said:

The point of my question is why would an expert make me guess which Ace he holds after I take my Club Q and 4th Club, if held.

Unless I've misunderstood, you're talking about what partner would do with ♣AKx and one major-suit ace? I think it would be poor play for him to cash the ace.

Given what dummy is, it seems optimistic to hope that holding this to 9 tricks is going to produce a reasonable score, so I think partner should be trying to beat this. His best chance to do this is to hold onto his ace.

If we have five clubs, ♣QJxx, or our own ace, the contract will go down regardless of what he does - when we cash our fourth winner, he'll be able to signal where his ace is.

If we have ♣Qxxx together with K or QJ of partner's ace suit, we'll switch to that suit, as it needs less from him to beat the contract. For partner to cash the ace first would cost the contract if we had QJ, and could not gain.

The only time that cashing his ace first might gain is if we had the king of his ace suit and K or QJ of the other major, and we were going to misguess. On half of these hands we would have guessed correctly, so even without considering the relative likelihoods of these layouts it seems clear that it's best for him not to cash his ace.